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The Changelog

The Changelog

Conversations with the hackers, leaders, and innovators of software development. Hosts Adam Stacoviak and Jerod Santo face their imposter syndrome so you don?t have to. Expect in-depth interviews with the best and brightest in software engineering, open source, and leadership. This is a polyglot podcast. All programming languages, platforms, and communities are welcome. Open source moves fast. Keep up.


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OSCON 2019 Anthology

We?re on the expo hall floor of OSCON 2019 talking with Eric Holscher, Ali Spittel, and Hong Phuc Dang. First up, we talk to Eric about his work at Write the Docs, ethical advertising, and the Pac-Man rule at conferences. Second, we talk with Ali about her passion for teaching developers, her passion for writing, and her new found love for podcasting. Last, we talk with Hong about her work at FOSSASIA, the disconnect between America and Asia in open source, and several of the cool open source projects they have on GitHub.
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Shaping, betting, and building

Ryan Singer, head of Product Strategy at Basecamp, joined the show to talk about their newest book ? Shape Up: Stop running in circles and ship work that matters. It?s written by Ryan himself and you can read it right now for free online at We talked about the back story of the book, how the methodology for Shape Up developed from within at Basecamp, the principles and methodologies of Shape Up, how teams of varying sizes can implement Shape Up. Ryan even shared a special invitation to our listeners near the end of the show to his live and in-person Shape Up workshop on August 28th in Detroit, Michigan.
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Observability is for your unknown unknowns

Christine Yen (co-founder and CEO of Honeycomb) joined the show to talk about her upcoming talk at Strange Loop titled ?Observability: Superpowers for Developers.? We talk practically about observability and how it delivers on these superpowers. We also cover the biggest hurdles to observability, the cultural shifts needed in teams to implement observability, and even the gains the entire organization can enjoy when you deliver high-quality code and you?re able to respond to system failure with resilience.
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Federating JavaScript's language commons with Entropic

We?re joined by C J Silverio, aka ceejbot on Twitter, aka 2nd hire and former CTO at npm Inc. We talk with Ceej about her recent JS Conf EU talk titled ?The Economies of Open Source? where she laid our her concerns with the JavaScript language commons being owned by venture capitalists. Currently the JavaScript language commons is controlled by the npm registery, and as you may know, npm is a VC backed for profit start up. Of course we also talk with Ceej about the bomb she dropped, Entropic, at the end of that talk ? a federated package registry for JavaScript C J hopes will unseat npm and free the JavaScript language commons.
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Go is eating the world of software

We?re joined by Ron Evans at OSCON on the expo hall floor talking about Go and how it?s eating the world of software. Specifically we?re talking about TinyGo and what they?re doing to bring the Go programming language to micro-controllers and modern web browsers. According to Ron Evans, ?embedded systems and Go are the most exciting things happening right now.?
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The war for the soul of open source

Adam Jacob (co-founder and board member of Chef) joins the show to talk about the keynote he?s giving at OSCON this week. The keynote is titled ?The war for the soul of open source.? We talked about what made open source great in the first place, what went wrong, the pitfalls of open core models, licensing, and more. By the way, we?re at OSCON this week so if you make your way to the expo hall, make sure you come by our booth and say hi.
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Learning the BASICs

We partnered with Red Hat to promote Season 3 of Command Line Heroes ? an original podcast from Red Hat, hosted by Saron Yitbarek, about the people who transform technology from the command line up. It?s an awesome show and we?re huge fans of Saron and the team behind the podcast, so we wanted to share it with you. Learn more and subscribe at
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The Pragmatic Programmers

Dave Thomas and Andy Hunt, best known as the authors of The Pragmatic Programmer and founders of The Pragmatic Bookshelf, joined the show today to talk about the 20th anniversary edition of The Pragmatic Programmer. This is a beloved book to software developers all over the world, so we wanted to catch up with Andy and Dave to talk about how this book came to be, some of the wisdom shared in its contents, as well as the impact it?s had on the world of software. Also, the beta book is now ?fully content complete? and is going to production. If you decide to pick up the ebook, you?ll get a coupon for 50% off the hardcover when it comes out this fall.
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Introducing Command Line Heroes

We partnered with Red Hat to promote Season 3 of Command Line Heroes ? an original podcast from Red Hat, hosted by Saron Yitbarek, about the people who transform technology from the command line up. It?s an awesome show and we?re huge fans of Saron and the team behind the podcast, so we wanted to share it with you. Learn more and subscribe at
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Maintainer spotlight! Ned Batchelder

In this episode we?re shinning our maintainer spotlight on Ned Batchelder. Ned is one of the lucky ones out there that gets to double-dip ? his day job is working on open source at edX, working on the Open edX community team. Ned is also a ?single maintainer? of - a tool for measuring code coverage of Python programs. This episode with Ned kicks off the first of many in our maintainer spotlight series where we dig deep into the life of an open source software maintainer. We?re producing this series in partnership with Tidelift. Huge thanks to Tidelift for making this series possible.
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Boldly going where no data tools have gone before

Computer Scientist Yaw Anokwa joins the show to tell us how Open Data Kit is enabling data collection efforts around the world. From monitoring rainforests to observing elections to tracking outbreaks, ODK has done it all. We hear its origin story, ruminate on why it?s been so successful, learn how the software works, and even answer the question, ?are people really using it in space?!? All that and more?
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The state of CSS in 2019

We?re talking with Sacha Greif to discuss the State of CSS survey and results. CSS is evolving faster than ever. And, coming off the heels of their annual State of JavaScript survey, they?ve decided to take on the world of styles and selectors to help identify the latests patterns and trends in CSS. We talk through the history and motivations of this survey, the methodology of their data collection, the tooling involved to build and run the survey, and of course we dig deep into the survey results and talk through the insights we found most interesting.
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Python's new governance and core team

We?re talking with Brett Cannon for a behind the scenes look at Guido stepping down as Python?s BDFL (Benevolent dictator for life) and the process they had to go through to establish a new governance model, the various proposed PEPs to establish this new direction, the winning PEP, and what the future holds for Python.
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Creating and selling multiplayer online games

We?re talking with Victor Zhou about the explosion of the .io game genre. We talked through all the details around building and running one of these games, the details behind Victor?s super popular game called Generals ? which he eventually sold, and we also covered the economics behind creating and selling one of these games.
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Off the grid social networking with Manyverse

We?re talking with Andre Staltz, creator of Manyverse ? a social network off the grid. It?s open source and free in every sense of the word. We talked through the backstory, how a user?s network gets formed, how data is stored and shared, why off-grid is so important to Andre, and what type of user uses an ?off-the-grid? social network.
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Quirk and Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT)

We?re talking with Evan Conrad ? for most of Evan?s life he has suffered from severe panic attacks, often twice per week. Eventually he stumbled upon a therapy method called Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, or CBT for short, and saw positive results. This led him to create Quirk, an open source iOS app which allows its users to practice one of the most common formats of CBT. On the show we mentioned a new podcast we?re launching called Brain Science ? it?s hosted by Adam Stacoviak and Mireille Reece, a Doctor of Clinical Psychology. Brain Science is a podcast for the curious that explores the inner-workings of the human brain to understand behavior change, habit formation, mental health, and the human condition. It?s Brain Science applied ? not just how does the brain work, but how do we apply what we know about the brain to better our lives. Stay tuned after the show for a special preview of Brain Science. If you haven?t yet, right now would be a great time to subscribe to Master at It?s one feed to rule them all, plus some extras that only hit the master feed.
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Inside the 2019 infrastructure for

We?re talking with Gerhard Lazu, our resident ops and infrastructure expert, about the setup we?ve rolled out for 2019. Late 2016 we relaunched as a new Phoenix/Elixir application and that included a brand new infrastructure and deployment process. 2019?s infrastructure update includes Linode, CoreOS, Docker, CircleCI, Rollbar, Fastly, Netdata, and more ? and we talk through all the details on this show. This show is also an open invite to you and the rest of the community to join us in Slack and learn and contribute to Head to to get started.
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Running functions anywhere with OpenFaaS

We?re talking with Alex Ellis, the founder of OpenFaaS ? serverless functions made simple for Docker and Kubernetes. We talked about the backstory and details of OpenFaaS, ?the curious case of serverless on Kubernetes,? the landscape of open source serverless platforms, how Alex is leading and building this community, getting involved, and maintainership vs leadership.
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From zero to thought leader in 6 months

We?re talking with Emma Wedekind about going from zero to thought leader in 6 months. We talk about the nuances of UX including the differences between an UX Designer and a UX Engineer, we touch on ?the great divide?, and we talk about Coding Coach ? the open source project and community that Emma and others are building to connect software developers and mentors all over the world.
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Wasmer is taking WebAssembly beyond the browser

We?re talking with Syrus Akbary about WebAssembly and Wasmer ? a standalone just in time WebAssembly runtime aiming to be fully compatible with Emscripten, Rust, and Go. We talked about taking WebAssembly beyond the browser, universal binaries, what?s an ABI?, running WebAssembly from any language, and what a world might look like with platform independent universal binaries powered by WebAssembly.
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All things text mode

We?re talking all things text mode with Lucas da Costa ? we logged his post ?How I?m still not using GUIs in 2019? a guide focused on making the terminal your IDE. We talked through his Terminal starter pack which includes: neovim, tmux, iterm2, and zsh by way of oh-my-zsh, his rules for learning vim, the awesomeness of CLI?s, and the pros and cons of graphical and plain text editors.
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Why smart engineers write bad code

We?re talking with Adam Barr, a 23 year Microsoft veteran, about his book ?The problem with software,? sub-titled ?Why smart engineers write bad code.? We examine that very idea, the gap between industry and academia, and more importantly what we can do to get a better feedback loop going between them.
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Funding OSS with Mozilla Open Source Support awards

We?re talking with Mehan Jayasuriya program officer at Mozilla about MOSS ? the Mozilla Open Source Support (MOSS) program which recognizes, celebrates, and supports open source projects. Earlier this year we caught the ?MOSS 2018 Year in Review? blog post ? this post highlighted many of their efforts in 2018 so we reached out to talk through the history, goals, and impact of this very generous project.
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Homebrew! Part Deux

We?re talking with Mike McQuaid about Homebew 2.0.0, supporting Linux and Windows 10, the backstory and details surrounding the security issue they had in 2018, their new governance model, Mike?s new role, the core team meeting in-person at FOSDEM this year, and what?s coming next for Homebrew.
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Containerizing compute driven workloads with Singularity

We?re talking with Greg Kurtzer, the founder of CentOS, Warewulf, and most recently Singularity ? an open source container platform designed to be simple, fast, and secure. Singularity is optimized for enterprise and high-performance computing workloads. What?s interesting is how Singularity allows untrusted users to run untrusted containers in a trusted way. We cover the backstory, Singularity Pro and how they?re not holding the open source community version hostage, as well as how Singularity is being used to containerize and support workflows in artificial intelligence, machine learning, deep learning, and more.
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Enabling open code for science at NumFOCUS

We?re talking with Gina Helfrich the Communications Director for NumFOCUS about their story and history, the impact of open code on science, the difference between sponsored and affiliated projects, corporate backing, the back story of their education and events program PyData, and the struggles of storytelling and fundraising.
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With great power comes great responsibility

Adam and Jerod are joined by JS Party panelist Nick Nisi and #causeascene advocate Kim Crayton for a deep discussion on ethics in the technology industry at-large and our roles as software developers. If you?ve never heard Kim describe what life is like online for underrepresented and marginalized folks, you have to listen to this show!
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Tactical design advice for developers

Adam talks with Erik Kennedy about tactical design advice for developers. Erik is a self-taught UI designer and brings a wealth of practical advice for those seeking to advance their design skills and learn more about user interface design. We cover his seven rules for creating gorgeous UI, the fundamentals of user interface design ? color, typography, layout, and process. We also talk about his course Learn UI Design and how it?s the ultimate on-ramp for upcoming UI designers.
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A UI framework without the framework

Jerod and Adam talked with Rich Harris ?a JavaScript Journalist on The New York Times Investigations team? about his magical disappearing UI framework called Svelte. We compare and contrast Svelte to React, how the framework is embedded in a component, build time vs. run time, scoping CSS to components, and CSS in JavaScript. Rich also shares where Svelte v3 is heading and the details on Sapper, a framework for building extremely high-performance progressive web apps, powered by Svelte.
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GitHub Actions is the next big thing

Adam and Jerod talk to Kyle Daigle, the Director of Ecosystem Engineering at GitHub. They talk about GitHub Actions, the new automation platform announced at GitHub Universe this past October 2018. GitHub Actions is the next big thing coming out of GitHub with the promise of powerful workflows to supercharge your repos and GitHub experience. Build your container apps, publish packages to registries, or automate welcoming new users to your open source projects ? with access to interact with the full GitHub API and any other public APIs, Actions seem to have limitless possibilities.
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source{d} turns code into actionable insights

Adam caught up with Francesc Campoy at KubeCon + CloudNativeCon 2018 in Seattle, WA to talk about the work he?s doing at source{d} to apply Machine Learning to source code, and turn that codebase into actionable insights. It?s a movement they?re driving called Machine Learning on Code. They talked through their open source products, how they work, what types of insights can be gained, and they also talked through the code analysis Francesc did on the Kubernetes code base. This is as close as you get to the bleeding edge and we?re very interested to see where this goes.
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Perspectives on Kubernetes and successful cloud platforms

Adam caught up with Brendan Burns (co-creator of Kubernetes and Partner Architect at Microsoft Azure) at KubeCon + CloudNativeCon 2018 in Seattle, WA to talk about the state of Kubernetes, the importance of community, building healthy cloud platforms, and the future of cloud infrastructure.
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State of the "log" (2018)

On this year?s ?State of the ?log?? episode we?re going behind the scenes to look back at 2018 as we prepare for 2019 and onward. We talk through our most popular episodes, most controversial episodes, and even some of our personal favorites. We also catch you up on some company level updates here at Changelog Media. We hired Tim Smith earlier this year as our Senior Producer, we retired Request for Commits, started some new shows?
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Untangle your GitHub notifications with Octobox

Jerod is joined by Andrew Nesbitt and Ben Nickolls to talk Octobox, their open source web app that helps you manage your GitHub notifications. They discuss how Octobox came to be, why open source maintainers love it, the experiments they?re doing with pricing and business models, and how Octobox can continue to thrive despite GitHub?s renewed interest in improving notifications.
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The insider perspective on the event-stream compromise

Adam and Jerod talk with Dominic Tarr, creator of event-stream, the IO library that made recent news as the latest malicious package in the npm registry. event-stream was turned malware, designed to target a very specific development environment and harvest account details and private keys from Bitcoin accounts. They talk through Dominic?s backstory as a prolific contributor to open source, his stance on this package, his work in open source, the sequence of events around the hack, how we can and should handle maintainer-ship of open source infrastructure over the full life-cycle of the code?s usefulness, and what some best practices are for moving forward from this kind of attack.
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A good open source password manager? Inconceivable!

Perry Mitchell joined the show to talk about the importance of password management and his project Buttercup ? an open source password manager built around strong encryption and security standards, a beautifully simple interface, and freely available on all major platforms. We talked through encryption, security concerns, building for multiple platforms, Electron and React Native pros and woes, and their future plans to release a hosted sync and team service to sustain and grow Buttercup into a business that?s built around its open source.
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Tidelift's mission is to pay open source maintainers

In this special crossover episode of Founders Talk, Adam talks with Donald Fischer. Donald Fischer and the team at Tidelift are on a mission of making open source work better ? for everyone. To pay the maintainers of open source software they are putting a new spin on a highly successful business model that?s a win-win for the maintainers as well as the software teams using the software. In this episode we dig into that backstory and Donald?s journey.
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The road to Brave 1.0 and BAT

This week Adam and Jerod talk with Brian Bondy, Co-founder and CTO of Brave. They talked through the beginnings of Brave and how BAT (Basic Attention Token) could be driving the future of how we offer funding and tips to our favorite websites and content creators. Of course, they go deep into the historical and the technical details of the Brave browser and their march to Brave 1.0. The last segment of the show covers how BAT works, how it?s being used, and also their interesting spin on an ad model that respects the user?s privacy.
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There and back again (Dgraph's tale)

This week we talk with Manish Jain about Dgraph, graph databases, and licensing and re-licensing woes. Manish is the creator and founder Dgraph and we talked through all the details. We covered what a graph database is, the uses of a graph database, and how and when to choose a graph database over a relational database. We also talked through the hard subject of licensing/re-licensing. In this case, Dgraph has had to change their license a few times to maintain their focus on adoption while respecting the core ideas around what open source really means to developers.
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Drupal is a pretty big deal

Adam and Jerod talk with Angie Byron, a core contributor and staple of the Drupal community. We haven?t covered Drupal really (sorry about that), but the call with Angie was inspiring! From the background, to the tech, the usage of the software, the communication at all levels of the community ? Drupal is doing something SO RIGHT, and we?re happy to celebrate with them as they march on to the ?Framlication? beat of their own drum.
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Venture capital meets commercial OSS

Joseph Jacks, the Founder and General Partner of OSS Capital joined the show to share his plans for funding the future generation of commercial open source software based companies. This is a growing landscape of $100M+ revenue companies ~13 years in the making that?s just now getting serious early attention and institutional backing ? and we talk through many of those details with Joseph. We cover the whys and hows, why OSS now, deep details around licensing implications, and we speculate the types of open source software that makes sense for the types of investing Joseph and other plan to do.
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Keepin' up with Elm

Jerod invites Richard Feldman back on the show to catch up on all things Elm. Did you hear? NoRedInk finally had a production runtime error, the community grew quite a bit (from ?obscure? to just ?niche?), and Elm 0.19 added some killer new features around asset optimization.
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BONUS ? Sustain Summit 2018

In this special bonus call, Adam and Jerod talk with Allen ?Gunner? Gunn about the Sustain Summit. They talk about what it is, the kind of conversations that happen there, issues the open source community are facing right now, and how Sustain stands out from traditional ?unconferences.? Sustain 2017 was a big hit, and this year?s event should be even better. Join us!
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A call for kindness in open source

Adam and Jerod talk to Brett Cannon, core contributor to Python and a fantastic representative of the Python community. They talked through various details surrounding a talk and blog post he wrote titled ?Setting expectations for open source participation? and covered questions like: What is the the purpose of open source? How do you sustain open source? And what?s the goal? They even talked through typical scenarios in open source and how kindness and recognizing that there?s a human on the other end of every action can really go a long way.
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#Hacktoberfest isn?t just about a free shirt

#Hacktoberfest is a once per year event in the month of October celebrating open source. For many it?s an on ramp to open source, PRs galore for maintainers, and t-shirts for those who submit 5 or more pull requests. In the end, however, it?s about the awareness of open source and its significance to the greater good to humanity as we know it. Adam and Jerod talk with Daniel Zaltsman, Dev Rel Manager at DigitalOcean and key leader of Hacktoberfest to cover the backstory, where this project began, its impact on open source, how it has had to scale each year by many orders of magnitude, and of course we cover how you can play your part in #Hacktoberfest and give back to open source.
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REST easy, GraphQL is here

In this special rebroadcast of JS Party, Jerod and Suz talk with John Resig about how he?s using GraphQL at Khan Academy, some of the mistakes and successes using GraphQL, John?s feelings on jQuery, and community Q&A.
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Join the federation?! Mastodon awaits...

We talked with Eugen Rochko, the creator of Mastodon, about where Mastodon came from the problem it aimed to solve. How it?s not exactly Twitter alternative, although that?s its known claim to fame. Why it?s probably not going anywhere. The ins-and-outs of federation, getting started, running an instance, why you would want to ? cool stuff you?ve never considered could be built on top of Mastodon. And finally, the story behind naming posted content a ?toot?.
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Kubernetes brings all the Cloud Natives to the yard

We talk with Dan Kohn, the Executive Director of the Cloud Native Computing Foundation to catch up with all things cloud native, the CNCF, and the world of Kubernetes. Dan updated us on the growth KubeCon / CloudNativeCon, the state of Cloud Native and where innovation is happening, serverless being on the rise, and Kubernetes dominating the enterprise.
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The first cloud native programming language

Jerod talked with Paul Fremantle, the CTO and Co-Founder of WSO2, about their new programming language, Ballerina ? a cloud-native language which aims to make it easier to write microservices that integrate APIs. They talked about the creation of the language and how it was inspired by so many technologies, cloud native features like built-in container support, serverless-friendly, observability, and how it works with, or without, a service mesh ? just to name a few.
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Segment's transition back to a monorepo

Adam and Jerod talk with two members of Segment?s engineering team: Co-founder and CTO, Calvin French-Owen, as well as Software Engineer, Alex Noonan, about their journey from monorepo to microservices back to monorepo. 100s of problem children to 1 superstar child.
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En liten tjänst av I'm With Friends. Finns även på engelska.
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