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War on the Rocks

War on the Rocks

Discussions over drinks with security, defense, and foreign policy insiders and experts. The original War on the Rocks podcast series.


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The Ebb and Flow of Russian Military Power

On this special edition podcast, listeners will get to hear the first 20 minutes of Mike Kofman's members-only podcast, The Russia Contingency. Mike spoke last week with William C. Wohlforth, a faculty member in Dartmouth College?s department of government about Russia, its role in the world and American power in Europe. The 45-minute conversation explored in-depth the challenges of forecasting, analyzed Russian revisionism and explored the future of great power competition.

To listen to the show in its entirety, and to other episodes of The Russia Contingency, sign up to become a War on the Rocks Member.


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Ukraine's Offensive and its Meaning for the War

Following Russia's failed winter offensive, Ukraine appears to be preparing for its planned counter-offensive. Ryan sat down with Mike Kofman to discuss the state of Russia's armed forces, the current state of the Western-led effort to train and equip Ukrainian forces and the latest from the battle for Bakhmut. The conversation also touched on the role of the British-supplied Storm Shadow cruise missile, Ukraine's ability to absorb the F-16, what exactly happened during the recent cross-border attack on Belgorod and revisited concerns about nuclear escalation.

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Why Erdogan Wins

This week, Ryan sat down at a cafe in Washington, D.C., with Hümeyra Pamuk and Nicholas Danforth to discuss the results of Turkey's May 14 election. They talked about the nature of President Erdogan's rule, the roots of his political longevity and what these elections mean for Turkey's future.

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The Calm Before the Storm: Waiting for Ukraine's Offensive

Ryan sat down with Mike Kofman at WOTR HQ in Washington, DC to talk about Ukraine's coming offensive; the manpower, materiel, and politics behind it; and lingering questions about Team Biden's theory of success.

Are you a War on the Rocks member yet? If not, why not? Check it out at

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A Conversation with Gen. CQ Brown, Chief of Staff of the Air Force

Ryan recently tagged along on a little trip to Alabama with Gen. CQ Brown, the chief of staff of the Air Force. They recorded this episode on the flight back to Washington. Gen. Brown discussed basing and posture in the Indo-Pacific, what the Air Force might be learning from the war in Ukraine, his vision for the Air Force as expressed in Accelerate Change or Lose, artificial intelligence, books that have influenced him, and his passion for leadership. 

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China, France, and the Shadow of History

Ryan sat down at 1789 in Georgetown with Justin Vaïsse, a French historian and director general of the Paris Peace Forum, an independent NGO he started at the urging of French President Emmanuel Macron. Justin recently returned from China where he was traveling with Macron. They discussed Macron's recent remarks about China that were so poorly received in Washington, the work of his organization, and what he learned from the Cold War.

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Powering American Renewal with Innovation

Ryan sat down with two old friends for a rich conversation on wielding innovation and smart policies to create an American renewal. Listen to his conversation with Dave McCormick, author of Superpower in Peril: A Battle Plan to Renew America (along with James Cunningham) and Chris Brose of Anduril Industries.

The first 15 people that email editor (at) warontherocks (dot) com with a personal story about how you participated in innovation in some way will get a free hardcopy of Superpower in Peril.

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Russia Will Soon Be on the Defense, But Then What?

Mike Kofman joins the show yet again. This time, he explains why the debate over the wisdom of the Battle for Bahkmut is so important while still overshadowing other important debates. As Ukrainian forces are being pressed out of the city of Bahkmut, they preparing to go back on the offensive, which will put Russia on the defense. The critical issue in Mike's view is what happens after the Ukrainian offensive. Listen to understand why.

Do you want to listen to more Mike? Become a member and you get access to his show, the "Russia Contingency."


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The Military and Great Powers: The Latest From Latin America, Part 2

Nicholas Danforth recently sat down with Agustina Giraudy, Adam Isacson and Anya Prusa to discuss the latest political developments in Latin America. This the second installment of our two-part podcast. The conversation began with an overview of the role of the military in different Latin American countries, before pivoting to an examination of regional views of great powers. The conversation concluded with a discussion about U.S. policy in the region, and how different governments view the Biden administration.

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Central Command's Big Technology Bets

On this episode, Ryan sat down with Schuyler Moore, the chief technology officer for U.S. Central Command, to discuss how it is planning to fight and win the next war with new and exciting technology.

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The Latest From Latin America, Part 1

Nicholas Danforth recently sat down with Agustina Giraudy, Adam Isacson and Anya Prusa to discuss the latest political developments in Latin America. This two-part podcast covers the rise of the Left in the region as well as its implications for relations with Washington, Moscow and Beijing.


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How to Think About Bakhmut and a Ukrainian Spring Offensive

Fresh back from his research trip to Ukraine, Mike Kofman joins Ryan for a discussion about what he learned. They discuss the battle for Bakhmut, munitions shortages and force structure, artillery and attrition, Russia's unimpressive offensive, and what else the West could be doing to set Ukraine up for success in a widely anticipated spring offensive.

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Backing Ukraine Against Russia, With Colin Kahl and Derek Chollet

Undersecretary of Defense for Policy Colin Kahl and Counselor to the Secretary of State Derek Chollet join the show to reflect on the war on year after Russia's brutal invasion and the commencement of Ukraine's monumental resistance. In a wide-ranging, hour-long conversation, the two respond to Ryan's questions about the arming of Ukraine, sanctions, choices about certain platforms and munitions, China, India, America's staying power, and much more.

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Russia's Winter Offensive

Mike Kofman sat down with Nicholas Danforth to discuss Russia's latest offensive, it?s focus, and why it has been underwhelming so far. The conversation analyzes the current state of the conflict, where it may be headed, the constraints each side may face in the coming months, and whether this year could see decisive turning points in the war.

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Unfolding Offensives and Counter-Offensives in Ukraine

Mike Kofman and Ryan Evans cover a lot of ground in this episode about the war in Ukraine: Russian goals in the Donbass, the coming Russian counter-offensive, the state of Russian and Ukrainian forces, tanks and infantry fighting vehicles, cluster and sensor-fuzed munitions, fourth-generation fighter aircraft, a warm winter, nuclear risk, and more. If you are interested in what's happening in and around Ukraine, this is another must-listen episode.

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Talking Strategy with Assistant Secretary of Defense Mara Karlin

Ryan sat down with Dr. Mara Karlin, who serves as assistant secretary of defense for strategy, plans, and capabilities. They discussed the making of the new National Defense Strategy, the critical topic of implementation, integrated deterrence, how Russia's fumbles in Ukraine have changed the way the Pentagon thinks about Moscow as an adversary, and a whole lot more.

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Manpower, Materiel, and the Coming Decisive Phase in Ukraine

In his latest discussion with Ryan on the war in Ukraine, Mike Kofman explains why the coming spring and summer will be strategically decisive. He also offers his analysis on the Russian command reshuffle, new Western kit, and the grinding battle for Bakhmut.

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A Disquieting Winter at War in Ukraine

Michael Kofman joins Ryan for their first discussion of the new year on the war in Ukraine. They cover the state of play at the various fronts, manpower and materiel, the Russian strike campaign, and more. 

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Nukes, Negotiations, and Lessons From the War in Ukraine

Ryan recently traveled to Air University at Maxwell Air Force Base where he was joined by three of the many big thinkers teaching servicemembers down there: Andy Akins, Anna Batta, and Mark Conversino. They covered the risk of nuclear war over Ukraine, the prospects for negotiations, why so many struggle with strategic empathy, and efforts to learn lessons from this war, which often stumble when we fail to learn lessons about ourselves.

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Localized Offensives: The Direction of the Conflict

Mike Kofman and Nick Danforth start this episode by analyzing the latest events in the war and the fighting in and around Bakhmut. Mike offers his thoughts on Russia and Ukraine's stockpiles of artillery, and what that may mean for the fighting this winter and beyond. The conversation concludes with a discussion about foreign support for the war effort, and the implications of this for the future of the conflict.

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Winter and Beyond: An Inflection Point in the War Over Ukraine

Mike Kofman and Ryan Evans start this episode by taking a step back to the beginning to put this stage of the war in context. Mike offers possible scenarios on the next few months of the war, discusses Ukraine's recent strikes on Russian bases deep in Russian territory, and assesses the state of forces, munitions, and kit on both sides. 

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Cognition and Curiosity: A Conversation with Lt. Gen. Brian Robinson

War on the Rocks threw a party for almost 200 people on the sidelines of I/ITSEC, the premier modeling and simulations conference held every year in Orlando. At this party, we had a special guest for a live podcast recording: Lt. Gen. Brian "Smokey" Robinson, the commander of Air Education and Training Command. In a chat with Ryan, he laid out his objectives, the future of education and immersive training for airman, and the centrality of data. Robinson emphasized this is not just about pilots ? as pilot training is only 10 percent of what his command does ? but all airmen. In forging ahead, he echoed former Assistant Secretary James Geurts, saying "We have to demand curiosity." The two also chatted about his career, why he joined the Air Force, and why squadron command was his favorite job. They also took some questions from the audience on professional military education, the T-7A program, his tentative 2023 pilot training goal, and his favorite superhero.

For a transcript of this episode, visit:

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Josh Wolfe on Investing in American Defense

Ryan sat down with Josh Wolfe, co-founder of Lux Capital, in his New York office earlier this month to talk about why he is drawn to invest in companies working on national security challenges. But the conversation covered much more than that. They covered everything from the major defense industry primes to why anger is an important driver of innovation to what he looks for in founders, and beyond.

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The Liberation of Kherson and the Next Phase of the War

On this episode, Ryan and Mike discuss the liberation of Kherson, the Russian military's strategy before the start of the winter, and Ukraine's efforts to retain the initiative once the weather improves in the spring. We also offer a sample from Mike's latest members-onlypodcast, the Russia Contingency, which features an in-depth conversation with RUSI senior research fellows, Justin Bronk and Jack Watling, about the Russian air performance during the war.

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A Conversation with Ukraine's Special Operations Commander

While in Ukraine, Ryan sat down with Brig. Gen. Viktor Khorenko, the commander of Ukraine's Special Operations Forces. They discussed the roles and missions of Ukraine's special operators in this war, from its opening days to the present, as well as how their Russian enemies have operated. We hope you enjoy this discussion, which marks the first time Khorenko has been interviewed. 

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Southward and Eastward Pressure on Russian Forces

Mike Kofman and Ryan Evans recorded this episode on the war as they return home from their week-long research trip to Ukraine. They cover the fight for Kherson, Russian failures in the east, Russia's attacks on Ukrainian infrastructure, and dirty bomb threats. If you're interested in hearing more from Mike, we are launching a members-only podcast that he hosts called "The Russia Contingency." We offer a sample of one of the early episodes of that show, which features Mike chatting with Konrad Muzyka about the current and future threat to Ukraine from Belarus. Become a member to get access.

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A Chat With Lt. Gen. Andrea Tullos of Air University

During a visit to Maxwell Air Force Base, Ryan had a chance to visit with Lt. Gen. Andrea Tullos, the president and commander of Air University. We spoke about her career, how she ended up commanding the lead agent for Air Force education, producing practitioners in the art and science of air-minded warfare, the addition of more wargaming at Air University, and preparing the Air Force for an era of strategic competition. She ends with a call for military personnel to engage in professional and public debate.

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What Will Be Ukraine's Pre-Winter Gains?

A blown up bridge, progressing Ukrainian operations in the east and south, and an unimpressive Russian mobilization effort. How should these be understood? Michael Kofman updates us on the war in Ukraine.

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The Kremlin in Command, Part II: Syria and the First Assault on Ukraine

Lawrence Freedman and Michael Kofman walk us through the post-Cold War history of the Kremlin as commander. In the second episode of this multi-part series, they focus on Russia's intervention in the Syrian Civil War and its first assault on Ukraine in the aftermath of Euromaidan. In Syria in particular, Moscow thinks it makes major progress on command and high-tech targeting, but that later proves to be something of a mirage. The Western intervention in Libya is also an important part of this period, informing how Vladimir Putin views threats to his own power and influence. Ukraine soon reveals itself to be an unresolved issue for Moscow. Don't miss the first part of this discussion, which focuses on the First and Second Chechen Wars as well as the Russo-Georgian War of 2008. In these episodes, Freedman draws on his new book, Command: The Politics of Military Operations from Korea to Ukraine.

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Russia's Plan to Stay in the War

After Ukraine's stunning Kharkiv counter-offensive, Vladimir Putin has doubled down on his war against Ukraine, announcing a large military mobilization, threatening nuclear use, and pressing ahead with referenda in territories Russia has seized from Urkaine. Can Putin salvage his campaign? Michael Kofman helps us understand these issues and more, encouraging people to think more temporally about Russia's mobilization pipeline and delivering a warning: We are in uncharted territory.

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The Kremlin in Command, Part I: The Chechen Wars and Georgia

Vladimir Putin's role as supreme commander has been center stage, offering a floundering and frightful performance. To understand the present, we reach back to the past. In the first of a multi-part series of episodes, Lawrence Freedman and Michael Kofman walk us through the post-Cold War history of the Kremlin and especially Putin as commander, starting with the First Chechen War through the short Russo-Georgian War (2008). In doing so, Freedman draws on his new book, Command: The Politics of Military Operations from Korea to Ukraine ( 


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Ukraine's Kharkhiv Operation and the Russian Military's Black Week

On a foggy morning in August 1918, Allied forces commenced the Battle of Amiens and the Hundred Days Offensive that ended the Great War. A German general later called it "the black day of the German Army." The Russian military has had a black week ever since Ukraine launched a counter-offensive in the Kharkiv Oblast. Whether this heralds the last phase of this war is still unknown. Regardless, recent events have been a massive setback for Russia. We had Mike Kofman on the show to discuss.

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Into the Breach: Ukraine?s Counter-Offensive Begins

Join us for another discussion with Michael Kofman on the war in Ukraine. The main focus of this episode is the southern counter-offensive launched by Ukrainian forces early this week. Mike explains what has happened so far in this operation, centered around Kherson, and how observers should think about it as it unfolds. The two also discuss what Ukrainian combined arms warfare looks like, manpower challenges on both sides, the airpower picture, and how the counter-offensive is affecting the war in different parts of the country. Also, what is happening in Belarus as far as this war is concerned? And is either side prepared for how long this war is likely to last?

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Awaiting a Ukrainian Counter-Offensive

Mike Kofman joins Ryan once again to update us all on the war in Ukraine. The big thing that everyone is watching for is evidence of an impending Ukrainian counter-offensive. Mike explains that we don't see that yet. He also discusses fighting around the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant, some events that surprised him, Ukrainian strikes on Russian-occupied Crimea, the expenditure of munitions, and the possibility that Russia might hold referenda in the territories it currently occupies in the east and south of Ukraine. Ryan and Mike also discuss slowing aid from Europe and whether European backers of Ukraine will hold through the winter. The big takeaway, however, is the Russia seems to have lost the momentum at this stage of the war and appears to be waiting to see what Ukraine does next. 

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Troubled Waters Around Taiwan

Speaker Nancy Pelosi's visit was met with fury and condemnation in Beijing, as well as new Chinese military exercises in the seas surrounding Taiwan. In the aftermath of the visit, Ryan invited three experts to talk about relations between the United States, Taiwan, and China. They discuss why the visit generated such a fierce reaction from the People's Republic of China, the role of legislative visits to Taiwan, the Taiwan Policy Act being considered on Capitol Hill, domestic politics in all three countries, and how Beijing tries to move the goal posts. Ryan banged on about discussions over Taiwan's security ought not be separated from debates over the size of the U.S. Navy. The guests called for a new policy review on Taiwan, the first in decades. And all three recommended some essential reading on this topic (episode reading:

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The Task Force at the Bleeding Edge of the Marine Corps

Maj. Gen. Frank Donovan of the U.S. Marine Corps sat down with Ryan to discuss the recent mission and exercises of Task Force 61/2, from Greece and Turkey to the Baltic Sea. Aside from playing an important role during a delicate moment in European security affairs, this task force was kicking the tires on Force Design 2030, the future vision for the Marine Corps, which we've previously discussed with the commandant, Gen. David Berger.

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Great Expectations? The Next Phase of the Russo-Ukrainian War

Michael Kofman joined Ryan for yet another conversation about the unfolding tragedy of the Russo-Ukrainian War. In this episode, they focus largely on the potential for a Ukrainian counter-offensive on Kherson. They also discuss Russia's repositioning of forces, continued (albeit smaller) Russian offensives in the east, the role of HIMARS, Russia's personnel strategy, and whether we can know if a Ukrainian victory is truly possible.

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Shinzo Abe's Legacy in Japan and on the World Stage

Shinzo Abe, Japan's former prime minister, was gunned down by an assassin earlier this summer. He is credited with having paved the road to his country's far more more prominent role in global affairs. Mireya Solis of the Brookings Institution and Sheila Smith of the Council on Foreign Relations discuss Abe's story and legacy in this episode.

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Ukraine's Window of Opportunity?

With military circles abuzz that Ukraine might be preparing to launch a counter-offensive against Russian-held Kherson, Michael Kofman of CNA's Russia team helps us parse the facts. What has been happening on the battlefield since our last episode? How are the two forces faring as they struggle with various problems in mobilizing manpower and equipment to the front? What are the four means by which Russia is trying to squeeze more military power out of its population short of a total mobilization? What of the Turkish-brokered grain export deal? If you want to know the answers to these questions and more, listen to this episode.

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Is the Most Important Battle of the War Coming?

Michael Kofman joins Ryan once again to discuss the Russo-Ukrainian War. In this episode, he discusses the looming battle for Slovyansk and Kramatorsk, two small cities near each other that are likely Russia's next effort after the fall of Severodonestk. He also revisits the idea of a Ukrainian counter-offensive to retake Kherson and the prospects for when, whether, and how that could unfold. Mike and Ryan also talk about Ukraine's challenges in mobilizing enough trained manpower at the front and keeping a diverse "petting zoo" of equipment from Western backers in the fight. 

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Ukraine and Russia Grapple with Relentless Battle and Attrition

Mike Kofman joins the show again to update us on the war in Ukraine. In this episode (which was recorded shortly before Russian forces withdrew from Snake Island), he explains that by focusing on the limited territorial exchanges in the Donbass, we might be missing the bigger strategic picture. Kofman argues that the Donbass is not the territory of greatest significance in this war. Instead, he points to Kherson, which he views as much more important in terms of future battles as well as its larger strategic and economic value. Mike and Ryan also tackle a host of other topics from Russian withdrawals of ammunition from stocks in Belarus, to Russian and Ukrainian struggles in mobilizing personnel, to the mirage of capabilities-based analysis. He closes with some thoughts on what defeat could look like for Ukraine.

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The Most Dangerous Phase for Ukraine?

This is not an optimistic episode. Michael Kofman speculates that the war might be in its most dangerous phase. Why is that? Ukraine's casualties and shortages in munitions are beginning to show as Russia is gaining some operational advantages in the Donbass. Further, Russia's efforts to fill its manpower gaps have been partially successful without relying primarily on conscripts and conducting a large mobilization. Ryan and Mike speculate that, in the end, this war will be decided by the country that can endure the longest, in terms of their economies, logistics, materiel, and political will. And Ukraine's endurance is tied up closely with the will of the West to continue backing Ukraine with arms and other supplies in a war that could continue to drag on for months, if not years.

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What the Experts Got Wrong (and Right) About Russian Military Power

It is now widely understood that many observers, in advance of this war, over-estimated Russian military performance and underestimated Ukrainian military performance. Prominent among those observers are those who specialize in analyzing the Russian military. To better understand what they got right and wrong, Ryan put two of those specialists ? Dara Massicot of RAND and Michael Kofman of CNA ? into conversation with two people who approach this conflict as generalists ? Chris Dougherty of the Center for a New American Security and Gian Gentile of RAND. Do not miss this vivid discussion.

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The Battlefields of the Donbass and Beyond

Michael Kofman sat down with Ryan again to sort through how the war in Ukraine is proceeding, with a focus on the Donbass, where Ukraine and Russia are concentrating their forces. Beyond the battlefields, Kofman ponders the future of the Russian armed forces and reports what he learned at a recent conference in Poland.

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Counter-Attacks and Can-Kicking in the Russo-Ukrainian War

Russia's stumbling war was launched almost three months ago. As Russian and Ukrainian forces battle on, how should we understand the state of play? Michael Kofman joins Ryan again to discuss the war on the ground, in the air, and at sea; Ukraine's ability to get Western weaponry into the fight; the crushing economic realities on both sides; how Vladimir Putin's Victory Day speech was the dog that didn't bark; Russia's stark mobilization constraints; and why a sliver of an island named after a snake has played such a prominent role in the conflict. Ryan puts an important question to Michael as Russia faces the real possibility of defeat: Under what circumstance would Putin use nuclear weapons?

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The U.S. Military Might Be More Like Russia's Military Than You Think

Did that title get your attention? It got Ryan's attention too when it came out of Steve Blank's mouth. If you're a War on the Rocks reader/listener, you've probably heard of him before. A successful entrepreneur, businessman, and veteran, Steve was one of the key architects of Hacking for Defense and, most recently, the Gordian Knot Center for National Security Innovation. And he is decidedly not optimistic about the state of U.S. defense innovation. In fact, he worries that the Defense Department's inability to innovate quickly and at scale might lead to defeat in a war against China. 

What about all these new entrants into the defense marketplace? Can the U.S. Defense Department be reformed before a catastrophe? And what are the stakes? Our guest answers these questions and more. And don't miss his tour de force presentation, "The Secret History of Silicon Valley."

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Ukraine's Military Advantage and Russia's Stark Choices

Our friend Michael Kofman popped in for another conversation with Ryan about where things stand in the Russo-Ukrainian War. He gives a wide-ranging assessment of Russia's unfavorable position as it musters an offensive in the Donbass that might be the last one that the Russian military is capable of launching before it is a spent force. From Ukraine's advanced Western kit to holdouts in Mariupol to the naval state of play to Russia's dire manpower shortages, Mike and Ryan discuss it all. Mike also gets into the nitty gritty on Russian infantry manning levels. 

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From Ukraine and Beyond: Unpacking the Sino-Russian Relationship

This is the national security podcast crossover of the century! Or at least of the year...ok maybe of Spring 2022! For this special episode, Doyle Hodges of TNSR and ?Horns of a Dilemma? hosts Zack Cooper, Melanie Marlowe, and Chris Preble of ?Net Assessment.? They try to sort through relations between Moscow and Beijing in this time of war, as well as a whole bunch of related issues. And yes, they engage in the airing of grievances, a ?Net Assessment? tradition. Make sure you subscribe to their podcasts, which are a part of the War on the Rocks family.

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A Conversation with the Counselor: Derek Chollet on Navigating the World

A veteran State Department official and scholar, Derek Chollet is serving as counselor to the secretary of state. He sat down with Ryan to discuss the various challenges facing U.S. foreign policy. Don't miss their wide-ranging conversation on the diplomacy that preceded the Russian invasion of Ukraine, the diplomacy that continues to keep Western allies on the same page, the withdrawal from Afghanistan, and the difficulties of balancing an increasingly competitive strategy in the Indo-Pacific while dealing with a brutal war in Europe.

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Russia Downscales Its War, But Not in Brutality

Michael Kofman joined Ryan once more to update us all on the war in Ukraine. In this episode, Kofman explains how and why Russia is refocusing on the east of Ukraine, what the war in Syria revealed about shortcomings in Russian air force, and what Ukrainian forces need in terms of weaponry and supply to win this war. The two also discuss Russian war crimes and their relation to the Russian military?s internal culture of violence and hazing as well as Vladimir Putin?s framing of this war of ?de-nazification.? The conversation ended with Kofman explaining Moscow?s big military manpower decision, which you may have missed, and how it connects to Putin?s difficult strategic position.

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