DNA: ID

Silkwood is a multi-part podcast that intricately examines the life of whistleblower Karen Silkwood, the nuclear behemoth she sought to expose, the government’s role in potential wrong-doings, and asks the question: What actually happened on that cold and windy November night 50 years ago? Did Karen fall asleep at the wheel and die as the result of a true single-car crash? Did she die for what she knew and what she was on her way to expose? Was it an accident…or something far more sinister?

Find Silkwood wherever you listen to podcasts.

For more information, including sources, please visit GoneCold.com/Silkwood

Episode 129 2024: The Year in Review

In this episode, Jess recaps all of the cases she presented in 2024 searching for commonalities and differences in the cases, the victims, and the offenders. Of course, Jess also recaps the Jane and John Doe cases, and she provides listeners with some case updates. DNA: ID will return in January, 2025, so keep an eye out on your feeds for new episode. Happy Holidays!

This episode is sponsored by Masterclass where you can learn from the best and be your best. DNA: ID listeners can take advantage of a special offer by visiting our special weblink.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 128 Terri McAdams Part 2 of 2

This is part 2 of the Terri McAdams case, if you have not listened to part 1 yet, please stop now, and go back and listen to that part first.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 128 Terri McAdams Part 1 of 2

Terri McAdams seemed to have a promising future ahead of her: a college degree, an upcoming wedding, and the love and support of friends, family, and fiancé.  But Terri was conflicted about her personal life, and was also deeply afraid. Someone was murdering young women in the Fort Worth, Texas area – women who were a lot like Terri.  On Valentine’s Day eve in 1985, Terri was next.  Her shockingly brutal murder and the theft of her engagement ring catapulted the Arlington PD into a massive, widespread and ultimately fruitless murder investigation.  Time and again, Terri’s case was reexamined, and put aside, until at long last, forensic genealogy linked her case to a murder/suicide that had occurred just months after Terri’s death. 

This episode is sponsored by Manscaped; the ultimate grooming experience. DNA: ID Listeners can head  over to Manscaped now and save 20%  plus free shipping on their order using promo code: DNAID at checkout.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 127 Doe: ID 'Mowry Avenue Jane Doe' 

On October 24, 1985, the body of a woman was found by hunters near Mowry Avenue in Newark, California. Although the remains were mostly skeletonized, it was clear that she was a homicide victim, and had been shot to death. It was estimated she had been dead for about six months. The dead woman had no ID, and the only items found with her included some barrettes, a watch, a ring on her finger, and some earrings. It was determined that the Jane Doe was a White woman likely 30-36 years old with Reddish Brown hair. Her height was estimated to be between 5ft6 and 5ft8. Without much to go on, "Mowry Avenue Jane Doe" or "Wetlands Jane Doe"  was laid to rest, but her case wasn't forgotten. Years later, DNA & genealogy would provide answers, but also more questions.  Her birth mother was identified as Marian Marie Richardson of Missouri. A half sister of Jane Doe's was also identified living in Texas. She has been adopted out as a baby by Marian. Marian told her family that she put one child up for adoption, but she never mentioned a second child that she gave up, and there is no record of her putting up another baby for adoption. So we know who Mowry Ave Jane Doe's Mother & half sister are, but we still do not know who she is, and we don't know who murdered her. If she can finally be identified, then maybe her killer can be as well. 

Investigators are still working Mowry Ave Jane Doe's case. If you have any information, please contact Newark Police Department Detective Andrew Musantry by phone at 510-578-4956 or email at [email protected]

Namus file

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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Episode 126 The Calgary Murders Part 2 of 2

This is part 2 of The Calgary Murders, if you have not listened to part 1 yet, please stop and go back and listen to that part first.

This episode is sponsored by Masterclass where you can learn from the best and be your best. DNA: ID listeners can take advantage of a special offer by visiting our special weblink.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 126 The Calgary Murders Part 1 of 2

At long last, Canadian listeners who have been requesting a case get their wish!  There was a horrific series of murders of girls and young women in the Calgary area in the 1970s and early 1980s.   In particular, teenagers Patsy McQueen and Eva Dvorak, and young women Barbara MacLean and Melissa Rehorek stood out.  There was no overt evidence of rape.  Some of the deaths weren’t even certain to be homicides.  No one was sure which cases, if any, were linked.  All the cases fell in RCMP jurisdiction, and thousands of hours were spent investigating them.  Task forces were formed and folded, wagons were circled… it was all for naught. Until a genealogy team and some dedicated CPS detectives partnered up … and what they uncovered was shocking.  In this case, Jess gets unprecedented cooperation from the RCMP about the cold case investigations and the yearlong inquiry into the unmasked killer.

This episode is sponsored by Manscaped; the ultimate grooming experience. DNA: ID Listeners can head  over to Manscaped now and save 20%  plus free shipping on their order using promo code: DNAID at checkout.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 125 Doe ID: Peggy Joyce Shelton

On July 19, 1972, the body of an unidentified woman was found by a young boy in Hernando County, Florida off of State Road 50 and High Corner Road in Brooksville. She had been dead for a few months. It was immediately clear to investigators that she was a murder victim who had been strangled to death. The victim was described as between 30 and 40 years old, approximately 5 feet tall, weighing between 125 and 145 pounds, with short brown hair, and they noted she had only six upper and six lower teeth. Police were searching for a mysterious White 1961-1962 Ford Fairlane that they may be connected to the murder. Police didn't have much else to go one other than the bedspread her body had been concealed in. It was described as  a “Pineapple Damask” print, and it had three square corners and a rounded corner. The case went cold and the Jane Doe was buried in a Pauper's grave. Decades later, police felt that they could ID their 1972 Jane Doe using forensic genetic genealogy. They exhumed her body, but was in very poor condtion, and they were worried that they would not be able to extract a DNA profile. After much effort, they were able to obtain a file and finally identified the Jane Doe as Peggy Joyce Shelton. When they looked into Peggy's background, they realized that her husband, Jerry Lee Fletcher, was connected to a motel that used bedspreads like the one Peggy was found in. It turns out that he never reported his wife missing. When police looked at his background, they found evidence of other victims with similar MO, and came to realize that he may have been a serial killer. Fletcher died in prison in 2014. Peggy Joyce Shelton finally has her name back, and this is her story. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 124 Maria Honzell Part 2 of 2

This is the conclusion of the Maria Honzell case. If you have not listened to part one now, please stop now and go back and listen to that part first.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 124 Maria Honzell Part 1 of 2

In February 1977, 14 year old Maria Honzell was babysitting for two little boys in her apartment complex.  While everyone thought the boys were asleep, someone stabbed her to death and left he bloodied body in the bedroom.  But the boys weren’t asleep – and one of them witnessed the crime.  His description of the killer drove the investigation for years to come – but didn’t help solve the case.  It took CeCe Moore and forensic genealogy to do that. When the police learned the name of the killer … it did not answer a lot of questions about what led up to the murder of Maria Honzell. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 123 Doe ID: Melissa Highsmith

This Doe ID episode is a bit different from most other ones, because the victim in this case is alive and well. In August, 1971, when Melissa Highsmith was just 22 months old, her mother Alta; desperate for a babysitter, allowed a stranger she didn't know to watch over her little girl in Fort Worth, Texas. Alta was terrified when the woman never contacted her again, and took Melissa with her. The woman had provided Alta with fake information, and no real way to contact her. With not much to go on, police were not much help. Alta prayed and believed in her heart that the woman who took Melissa did so because she wanted a little girl and would raise her and keep her safe.

Decades later, Alta along with her family members who never gave up hope that Melissa was out there someplace, began to do their own investigation, and called upon genealogy to help find her. After uploading their DNA profiles to a public database, they found family members that they believed to be biological children of  Melissa. More digging proved that they were correct, and they were finally reunited with Melissa who had indeed been raised by a woman she thought was her mother under an assumed name; Melanie Miyoko . Although Melissa had many struggles in her life, she was alive, and happy to reunite with her real family. She now has her real name back; it's Melissa Highsmith, and this is her story.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 122 Patricia Stichler Part 2 of 2

This is the conclusion of the Patricia Stichler case. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, please stop now and go back and listen to that part first.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 122 Patricia Stichler Part 1 of 2

New Years’ Day 1985 should have rung in an exciting new year for Patti Stichler and her three young daughters.  Instead, in the middle of the night on January 1-2, someone slashed and stabbed Patti to death in her bedroom.  Her three girls, ages 11, 9 and 6, were in their bedrooms just feet away.  The oldest, Andrea, was the one to find her mom, and also found the most significant clue the police had – the open window in the blood-stained bathroom, and the gaping curtains that had been cut away from it. A knife sheath was found right outside, but the killer eluded police for decades.  Sylvania, OH investigators focused on people Patti knew, but could not link anyone in her inner circle to the crime. Decades later, a very complex forensic genealogy analysis that required interpreting one-sided DNA matches, piercing adoption records, and a lot of luck, finally provided a name – and it was not who anyone suspected.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 121 Doe: ID 'Oscar Talley Road Jane Doe' Shawna Beth Garber 

In December, 1990, a couple discovered a human skull on an abandoned farm on Oscar Talley Road near Lanagan, Missouri. A search of the area by police revealed more bones, and clothing. The remains were determined to be that of a woman, but she carried no ID. A white towel had been wrapped around the woman's head, and she was tied with several types of bindings made up of ropes, cords, and coax cables. Due to the state of decomposition, the cause and manner of death could not be determined, but police were confident that the woman had been the victim of a homicide. The dead woman was given the name 'Oscar Talley Road Jane Doe' and police went about trying to figure out how she died and who was responsible; but first, they needed to find out their victim's name, and it would take decades. Along the way, her remains would even be misplaced, and finding them became an investigation within the investigation. In 2021, after more than three decades, genealogy and DNA were used to identify 'Oscar Talley Road Jane Doe' as Shawna Beth Garber. She was 22 years old when she died in 1990. As tragic as the end of her life was, as investigators dug into her background, it seemed as if Shawna never had an easy life; instead it was filled with abuse, and being separated from her family. Now that police knew who their victim was, they focused on finding the person that killed her, and they zeroed in on a man named Taffey Reeves. Unfortunately, Reeves was dead by the time this case was solved, and when investigators looked into his background, they found a disturbing pattern of crimes that led them to believe he was a serial killer. The investigation into Reeves and whether he has other victims is ongoing. After more than three decades, 'Oscar Talley Road Jane Doe' has her name back; it's Shawna Beth Garber, and this is her story. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 120 Melinda Salazar and Carrole Ann White 

Starting in 2017, someone started killing women in southwest Detroit, MI.  The killer struck at night, and always used the same weapon – his car.  Detroit police realized that they had a serial killer on their hands. His MO was always the same – pick up a white, female sex worker; have a sexual encounter with her in his vehicle; and then, run her down with that vehicle and rob her.  He was brazen, ruthless, and active, with at least five cases fitting his MO.  Despite all the trappings of modern technology at detectives’ disposal, they could not identify the Hit and Run Killer.  Finally, the application of forensic genealogy in an active investigation gave detectives what they needed – a name.  This episode features an exclusive interview with CeCe Moore on her genealogy analysis, and brings to listeners a case that received very little media coverage.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 119 Doe: ID 'Chimney Doe' Ronnie Joe Kirk 

In 1989, a custodian in a music store in Madison, Wisconsin discovered human remains in the chimney. At first, it was not clear that the remains were of a male or female, and remnants on clothing though to be a dress fueled confusion. An expert told police that the remains certainly belonged to a man, but since there was no ID with the body, they had no idea who the person was, nor did they know how their body had managed to get down the very small opening of the chimney, or if he was a homicide victim. For years the case remained a mystery, and the man was named 'Chimney Doe'. Eventually, DNA & genealogy proved that the remains were that of Ronnie Joe Kirk who dropped from sight in 1970 after losing contact with his family. Kirk was born in Oklahoma and is known to have travelled through Alabama, California, Missouri, North Carolina, Oklahoma, Texas and Wisconsin. Authorities now know who he is, but how his remains got where they were found, and whether or not he's a homicide victim, remain a mystery and police are still trying to put the pieces together. Chimney Doe now has his name back; it's Ronnie Joe Kirk, and this is his story. 

Episode 118 Donna Sue Hyatt

Donna Sue Hyatt was a loving daughter, sister, mother and grandmother who faced some challenges in life. She relied on her friends, family and faith to help her put a smile on her face every day, and she was always friendly, chatty and sunny – until someone murdered her on her living room floor. There were plenty of suspects both in Donna Sue’s life and in the larger Carlsbad, NM area she called home. But police could not pin the crime on any one of them, although they had their suspicions.  Eventually the case went cold. DNA testing in 2010 revived the case, but could not solve it.  It would take the advent of forensic genealogy to link a repeat offender to Donna’s brutal slaying – someone who had gotten away with it before. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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Episode 117 Doe ID: 'Rhinelander John Doe' Norman Grasser

On March 19,1980, a deceased man was found off of Highway 17, between Rhinelander and Eagle River in Wisconsin. He carried no ID, and the authorities came to the conclusion that he had died as a result of hypothermia, perhaps after falling in the cold and never waking up. The man didn't appear to have the ideal clothing or shoes for walking out in such a cold area, and he didn't carry any ID. After feeling comfortable that they had resolved how he died, the authorities struggled to find anyone in the area who they felt could be a match for him, and his prints were not found to be a match to any on file. The dead man was dubbed 'Rhinelander John Doe'.  Finally after advancements in DNA and genealogy, authorities decided to make a new attempt to ID Rhinelander John Doe, and in In January 2023, the Oneida County Sheriff’s Office enlisted the assistance of Ramapo College of New Jersey Investigative Genetic Genealogy Center to help solve the case. The plan worked, and Rhinelander John Doe was identified as Norman Grasser of Chicago. Just how he came to be in Wisconsin remains a mystery. His family had searched for him after filing a missing persons report, but unfortunately, authorities in Chicago never linked their missing persons case to the John Doe in Wisconsin. 'Rhinelander John Doe' finally has his name back; it's Norman Grasser, and this is his story. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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Episode 116 Terry Paquette

Terry Paquette worked 60+ hours a week as manager of the Lil Champ convenience store on Clarcona Ocoee Road in Lockhart, FL.  It was there that he was stabbed 73 times in the store bathroom in 1996.  The investigation was approached from several angles, including that Terry was slain in the course of a robbery, or that he was killed in a hate crime.  Detectives investigating the case over the years felt certain that Terry knew his killer, but a thorough dissection of his personal life failed to turn up any viable suspects.  When forensic genealogy came along, it pointed to someone detectives had never heard of – someone who had more connection to Terry and the Lil Champ than anyone had guessed. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 115 Doe ID 'Rock Collection John Doe' Captain Everett Leland Yager

A strange mystery unfolded after a boy in Arizona inherited a rock collection from his grandfather in 2002. The boy's mother while looking through the collection found something disturbing; something she knew was not a rock. It was a partial human jawbone containing several teeth. She contacted the Yavapai County Sheriff's office about the disturbing find. It was theorized at first that the remains could have come from a nearby Native American burial grounds, but they soon discounted that theory, and without any kind of clues to go on, they dubbed the remains 'Rock Collection John Doe'. 

In 2023, The Ramapo College of New Jersey’s Investigative Genetic Genealogy Center, decided to take on identifying the remains. They were successful; the remains belonged to a Captain Everett Leland Yager. There was just one problem, Captain Yager had died in plane crash in California in 1951, and he was laid to rest in his home state of Missouri. The identification of the Captain's remains solved one mystery, but opened up another; how did Captain Yager's jawbone wind up in Arizona decades after he was laid to rest in another state? 

After more than two decades, 'Rock Collection John Doe' finally has his name back; it's Captain Everett Leland Yager, and this is his story. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 114 Michella Welch

In this episode we cover the conclusion of the Michella Welch case.  If you haven’t listened to the Jenni Bastian case, (ep113) please go listen to that one first, as many details about Michella’s case are addressed there.  Michella would finally see justice of her own in 2022, nearly 40 years after her murder became inseparably linked to Jenni Bastian’s.  And, we talk to Detective Lindsey Wade about her role in solving these cases, and her brilliant book, “In My DNA: My Career Investigating Your Worst Nightmares.”

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 113 Jennifer Bastian Part 2 of 2

This is the conclusion of the Jennifer Bastian case. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part first. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 113 Jennifer Bastian Part 1 of 2 

On March 4th, 1986, the unthinkable happened for the Bastian family of Tacoma, WA.  Their sweet, energetic and athletic little girl Jenni, age 13, didn’t come home from a bike training session in Point Defiance Park.  Police believed Jenni and her bike had been taken from the park by a predator, and the FBI counseled the family to await a ransom call.  But the call never came.  And when Jenni was found murdered and hidden in a cleverly disguised cave among the brush, her case joined another horrific child murder in being attributed to a child serial killer plaguing Tacoma.  Michella Welch had been killed just four months earlier in another Tacoma park, and her case, too, was unsolved.  For the next quarter century, Tacoma investigators pursued the child killer who had taken two of Tacoma’s innocents in such brutal fashion.  But with the advent of modern DNA testing and analysis came answers – and they were not what anyone was expecting.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 112 Doe: ID Possible LISK Victims Karen Vergata and Valerie Mack

During the 1990's and 2000's, the remains of several murder victims; mostly female sex workers, were found on Long Island's beaches. To police it seemed clear that they were the victims of a serial killer, or even more frightening, two serial killers who were dumping victims in the same area. The killer or killers, were given the moniker LISK, or Long Island Serial Killer. Many of the victims were identified, but while police hunted for the killer, they also needed to ID the rest of the victims, and they succeeded finally in identifying two of them; Karen Vergata and Valerie Mack. 

Finally, in 2023, an arrest was made following a lengthy investigation of a suspect; architect Rex Heuermann. Searches of his home and vehicles, as well as an extensive investigation, seem to have uncovered a treasure trove of evidence pointing to his involvement in many of the murders. As the suspect awaits his day in court, police continued to try and ID the remaining Doe victims. For now though, Karen Vergata and Valerie Mack have their names back, and this is their story. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 111 Lindy Sue Biechler Part 2 of 2

This is the second part of the Lindy Sue Biechler case. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back to listen to part 1 first. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 111 Lindy Sue Biechler Part 1 of 2

The vicious, brutal 1975 stabbing murder of sweet, shy newlywed Lindy Sue Biechler haunted Lancaster, PA.  Lindy was stabbed 19 times right inside her front door, and a butcher knife left embedded in her neck, and police couldn’t determine any motive in the case.  The 19 year old had no enemies, and no one had seen or heard anything.  It was considered the most puzzling unsolved mystery in the area for decades.  Then, in 1997, a breakthrough in lab testing hinted at a motive – but not at a suspect.  Two decades later, even the powers of forensic genealogy came up short. But in pondering the genealogy, CeCe Moore detected a genetic pattern that she linked to immigration to Lancaster from a specific region in Italy. Fortuitous records of Italian immigrants to Lancaster helped her focus her search.  And when she considered these records alongside the phenotype information, she stumbled on a name – someone who had a connection to Lindy.  A coffee cup casually thrown into a garbage can at Philadelphia International Airport proved her hunch right, and Lindy’s family had answers at long last.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 110 Doe ID: Mary Alice Pultz Jenkins

In April, 1985, the skeltonised remains of a woman were discovered in a shallow grave on Crescent Beach, 50 miles south of Jacksonville,Florida. There was no identifcation, and no missing persons in the area matched the remains. Police quickly ruled the death a homicide but had very little clues to go on, other than some extensive injuries the victim had suffered some time before her death; wounds that had healed up. It was thought that she may have been in a serious car accident. They believed the victim was 30-50 years old. Overall, police had little to go on, and the case went cold. Over the years as DNA technology advanced, police tried various methods to ID their victim. Finally in May, 2024, Crescent Beach Jane Doe was identified as Rockville, MD native Mary Alice Pultz Jenkins. She had gone missing in 1968 after becoming estranged from her family. She was last known to be in the company of her boyfriend  John Thomas Fugitt, who detectives discovered went by the alias Billy Joe Wallace. Fugitt died on death row in 1981 for an unrelated murder. It's unclear if Fugitt could be responsible for Mary Alice's murder, and police are having trouble tracking the couple's movements prior to her body being found. They are still seeking tips from people to help fill in the blanks. Anyone with information is asked to contact the Saint John's County sheriff’s office at [email protected]

Mary Alice Pultz Jenkins finally has her name back, and this is her story.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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Nancy Brophy fills her novels with romantic betrayals and murder. It’s a far cry from her quiet life in the suburbs, where she and her chef husband, Dan, are living out their golden years. But when Dan is shot dead, Nancy finds herself at the center of a murder case that could be ripped from the pages of her novels.

From Wondery, this is a story about what happens when the line blurs between fiction and reality.

Listen to Happily Never After: Dan & Nancy on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge episodes early and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App or on Apple Podcasts. Start your free trial by visiting http://wondery.fm/HNA_DNA now. 

Episode 109 DNA ID Rewind: The Case of Troy and LaDonna French 

As host Jessica travels to and from the annual Crimecon convention, whether you have listened to every episode of the show, or just found it, Jessica invites listeners to check out this rewind episode from the DNA: ID vault; the case of Troy and LaDonna French, one of her personal favorite episodes. It's a re-release of episode 32.

Jessica will return with an all new episode of DNA: ID on June 10, 2024.

In 2012, a young woman called Rockingham County, NC authorities in the middle of the night and reported that an intruder had shot her parents. Troy and LaDonna French were mowed down with bullets in their own home. Their daughter Whitley, was left to tell the unbelievable story. Investigators knew that the killer was someone with access to the house – but who? After three years and 65 failed DNA comparisons, they were stumped. They decided to use sophisticated partial DNA matching to compare the killer’s DNA with that of someone close to the family – someone whose DNA did not match the killer’s in a straightforward comparison. Then, phenotyping gave them even more information - and what they found blew the case wide open.

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Episode 108 Eric Goldstrand and Lliana Adank Part

This is the conclusion of the Goldstrand/Adank case. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part first. 

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Episode 108 Eric Goldstrand and Lliana Adank Part 1 of 2

When 16 year old high schoolers Eric Goldstrand and Lliana Adank were shot to death in at the popular Fall Creek recreation area in June 1977, residents of the teens’ hometown of Eugene, Oregon were shocked and devastated.  There were hundreds of witnesses, tips, and leads… a surplus of information that led investigators nowhere.  Suspect after suspect failed to pan out, and the case went cold for years, then decades.  Extensive investigation into similar campground murders of couples also led nowhere.  Finally, a cold case detective determined to solve the murders was able to employ forensic genealogy to identify a potential suspect, who was alive and living in another state. Investigators closed in on him, but he knew they were coming.

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Episode 107 Doe:ID Jeffrey Kimzey 

On April 15, 1997, a young boy in Union Grove, Alabama decided to skip school and go fishing at his favorite spot off of Eagle Rock Drive. When he got to his spot, he made a gruesome discovery. He found a decomposing body in the water, and raced home to tell his parents. Police responded to the scene, and when they retrieved the body from the water, the gruesome find became even more shocking. The body, which belonged to a man, had been mutilated. His hands, feet, and head had been removed. In addition, his heart had also been taken. It was believed that he had been shot or stabbed to death. There was no ID with the body, and in the days before DNA, there wasn't much that the authorities could do to identify the man. Their best guess was that he was a White male between 20 and 30 years old, who weighed about 150 pounds and was five feet, nine inches tall. Since police had no missing men in that area who fit that description, they believed he was traveling through the area, and not a local. Their only clues were a bunch of air fresheners found close to the victim, and an eyewitness who spotted a very distinct truck in the area before the body was found. 

As time passed and DNA Science evolved, investigators had a sketch created based on the victim's DNA makeup. They released it hoping someone would recognize him, but no one did, which further backed up their belief that he was not local. Eventually, genealogy would provide John Doe's real name; it was Jeffrey Douglas Kimzey. He was from Santa Barbara, CA. He was 20 years old at the time he was killed. Police now know his name, and now they are trying to figure out who killed him, and what brought him to Alabama. The investigation continues.

This John Doe finally has his name back; it's Jeffrey Kimzey, and this is his story. 

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Episode 106 Rita Curran Part 2 of 2

This is the conclusion of the Rita Curran case. If you did not listen to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part first. 

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Episode 106 Rita Curran Part 1 of 2

The brutal 1971 murder of Rita Curran in her own bedroom rocked the tight-knit town of Burlington, Vermont.  The circumstances of Rita’s death seemed so random – yet pointed to an insider. The mystifying slaying had no apparent motive and no good leads, and perplexed generations of frustrated investigators.  The case was so out there, Ted Bundy was considered a viable suspect, with good reason.  Fifty years later, modern DNA technology would reach back in time and give a name to Rita’s killer, helping finally to assuage the heartache of Rita’s family and allowing Burlingtonians to put the tragic murder in their midst behind them.  

In this episode, Jessica announces the winners of the Rating/Review contest. 

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Episode 105 DOE: ID 'Mary Jane Doe' Tabetha Slain Murlin

In may, 1992, a construction worker renovating a home in Fort Wayne, Indiana made a gruesome discovery. In the flooded basement of the home, he discovered a woman's body wrapped in a blanket. Investigators were unable to determine an exact cause of death due to the condition of her remains, although they did make one important discovery; she was about 26 weeks pregnant when she died. Although police suspected foul play, they didn't have much in the way of leads to ID a suspect in her death, and they didn't even know who she was. Efforts to ID her came up empty, and she was laid to rest with the moniker 'Mary Jane Doe'.

Decades would pass before DNA & genealogy would finally provide some answers by late 2023; the dead woman was Tabetha Slain Murlin who was about 23 when she died. Her family had lost contact with her in the late 1980s, and although they tried to look for her over the next three decades, they had no luck, and presumed the worst.  Now, police know who Tabetha is, but if she met with foul play, they don't know who it was at the hands of. They would also like to determine the identity of her baby's father, and perhaps genealogy will one day help them do that. 

Anyone with information on what led to Tabetha Murlin's death should reach out to authorities at 260-427-1201 for the Fort Wayne Police Detective Bureau; Fort Wayne CrimeStoppers at 260-436-7867; or report an anonymous tip using the P3Tips mobile app.

After more than three decades, 'Mary Jane Doe' finally has her name back; it's Tabetha Slain Murlin, and this is her story.

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Episode 104 Sherri And Megan Scherer And Genevieve Zitricki Part 2 Of 2

This is the Part 2 of the Scherer/Zitricki cases. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and listen to that part first.

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Episode 104 Sherri and Megan Scherer and Genevieve Zitricki Part 1 of 2

In 1998, an unthinkable crime rocked farm community Portageville, Missouri.  Sherri Scherer and her 12 year old daughter Megan were shot and killed, and Megan was sexually assaulted, in their own home in a 41 minute window of time.  A massive investigation into one of the state’s most heinous crimes ensued.  And soon, with the discovery of more and more crimes, the investigation would burgeon into a multi-state investigative effort to catch a killer.  Finally, forensic genealogy using DNA collected from an adolescent rape survivor provided answers to the questions that had haunted investigators and families in Missouri, Tennessee, and South Carolina.  But many fear that these crimes were just the tip of the iceberg for the monster that was Robert Brashers.

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Episode 103 Doe: ID 'New York Billy' Clarence Wilson 

In 1986, the body of a man was pulled from Crater Lake in Montgomery TX 40 miles North of Houston. It soon became clear to investigators that he was the victim of a homicide having been shot multiple times, and his body weighed down with cinder blocks. Due to the injuries the man had suffered along with the water exposure and decomposition, police were unable to ID the man. He did have a couple tattoos, but it was not enough to help police give him his name back.  Somehow, police came to believe that the dead man went by the street name "New York Billy' but they didn't have much else, and he was laid to rest; buried with little hope of him ever being identified, or his killer caught. Years later as DNA Science evolved, police exhumed the man's body and used genealogy to finally ID him after decades. It turned out that New York Billy was actually Clarence Wilson who would have been 34 years old when he was found. He was living in Texas after a falling out with family back in Modesto, CA. He was last known by his family to be alive in 1985. 

Now the police know who New York Billy is, but they don't know who killed him or why. That part of the mystery remains, but police are working hard to provide answers. 'New York Billy' finally has his name back; it's Clarence Wilson, and this is his story

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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Episode 102 Jane Hylton 

Sometime between 10:30 p.m. and 3:30 a.m. on the night of July 6-7, 1985, someone entered the house she was staying at and stabbed Jane 54 year old Jane Hylton 29 times.  Police set their sights on the most likely suspect – another resident of the house, 20 year old Ricky Davis.  It was just too far-fetched to believe that someone else random had come along and killed Jane, and Ricky was arrested, tried, convicted, and sent to prison.  But when the Northern California Innocence Project took up his case, they found untested DNA evidence. And this evidence would change everything.  Forensic genealogy showed that Ricky was innocent – and someone else entirely was to blame for Jane’s vicious murder. 

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Episode 101 DOE: ID 'Valentine Sally' Carolyn Eaton 

On Valentine's Day, February 14th, 1982, the body of a young woman was discovered by a worker along interstate 40 in Williams, Arizona. It became clear quickly to investigators that she had been murdered, and her body dragged out of sight of the road.  She was given the moniker 'Valentine Sally' An autopsy revealed that she had died from suffocation or asphyxiation. One potential clue found by the ME, was that Valentine Sally had recently had a tooth drilled in preparation for a root canal, and baby aspirin remnants were found packed into the open hole in her gum.Police were able to find multiple witnesses that they were confident had interacted with Valentine Sally in the days before she was killed. One of them gave her a ride and recalled her talking about a toothache. The other witness, a truck stop waitress, was the one who provided Valentine Sally with the baby aspirin for her gum. This waitress was able to describe an older man in a cowboy hat who was with Valentine Sally, and a sketch was made of him

 Police sifted through hundreds of missing persons cases to ID Valentine Sally. They came to believe that she was Melody Cutlip; a runaway from Florida who left home in 1980. Despite Melody's mother saying that Valentine Sally was not her daughter, officials buried her and marked her headstone with the name Melody Cutlip, and closed her case. The case was thrown for a loop, when the real Melody Cutlip showed up alive and well. Police were back to square one with not much to go on. 

Decades later, genealogy would provide detectives with Valentine Sally's real name; it was Carolyn Eaton who had run away from her Missouri home following an argument with her mom, over the holidays in late 1981, or close to New Year's 1982. Now police know who Valentine Sally really is, but they don't know who killed her. It seems likely that they have his DNA, and they also have the sketch of the man last seen with Carolyn. Time will tell if it's enough to close her case once and for all. 

After four decades, Valentine Sally finally has her name back, it's Carolyn Eaton, and this is her story. 

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Episode 100 Cathy Sposito Part 2 of 2

This is the second part of episode 100; Cathy Sposito. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part first.

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Episode 100 Cathy Sposito Part 1 of 2

In April 1987, Cathy Sposito was brutally killed on a popular, scenic hiking trail in broad daylight in Prescott Arizona.  Despite multiple earwitnesses to her murder, her killer eluded police.  A massive investigation turned up two prime suspects, but there was no smoking gun.  Then, a 1990 sexual assault on the same trail mirrored the MO, and again, the killer escaped.  This time, the survivor was able to describe her attacker, but his identity remained unknown. The two crimes were linked only theoretically until DNA evidence connected them, and tied them to the same man.  And that man was given a name by forensic genealogy, which solved the two cases at once. 

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Episode 99 Doe ID 'Bones 17' Lori Anne Razpotnik

On December 30, 1985 Auburn city employees  25 miles south of Seattle, Washington were investigating a car that had gone over an embankment. While surveying the area, they made a startling discovery; two sets of human remains. The remains, which turned out to be those of two young women, could not be identified at the time and were named Bones 16 and Bones 17. For investigators, it became clear that the remains were quite possibly victims of The Green River Killer who was responsible for the murders of potentially dozens of sex workers in the Seattle area. 

Eventually, The Green River Killer was caught and identified as Gary Ridgway, and though he was more than willing to talk about his crimes with investigators, he couldn't ID all of his victims, so for years some of them remained un-named; including the victim referred to as 'Bones 17'. Eventually genealogy would reveal that Bones 17 was actually Lori Anne Razpotnik; who had run away from home as a teenager in Lewis County, Washington in 1982. Lori had called home over the Thanksgiving holiday to tell her family she was okay and living in Seattle, but they never heard from her again, and were left to wonder what happened to her. Sadly, she crossed paths with Gary Ridgway. After nearly four decades, 'Bones 17' has her name back; it's Lori Anne Razpotnik, and this is her story. 

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Episode 98 Krista Martin

In October 1989, Krista Martin was found bludgeoned and raped in her apartment in Wichita, Kansas.  Krista was a very social young woman with lots of friends and quite a bit of drama in her life – none of which led to her murder.  Police investigated thoroughly, but were stumped for years.  Krista’s case went cold until the WPD reopened it in 2020 with a focus on the DNA evidence.  Like most of DNA: ID’s cases, this case never would have been solved without forensic genealogy – but in this case, the genealogical analysis uncovered a misattributed parentage event, and left one family relieved and thankful to have answers, and one family in complete denial and anger. We still don’t know what happened between Krista and Paul Hart on that day in 1989. But we do know the he lived just six houses away from Krista, and that he killed her.

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Episode 97 Doe ID: Ada Fritz

In May, 1976,  a group of boys fishing along Sessions Creek in Grand Bay, Alabama when they found what appeared to be a mannequin in the water. Closer examination told them that it was the dead body of an older woman, and they ran to get help. Police retrieved the dead woman from the water and found that she had been shot in the head. She carried no ID, and her hands and dentures were missing. Police were not able to match her to any specific women that were missing and she was cremated and her ashes place into a mass grave. That might have been the end of ever finding out who the dead woman was had it not been for a crucial piece of luck and old evidence from the case that was re-examined. Police eventually were able to get a DNA profile from the dead woman, and genealogy determined that she was Ada Fritz who seemed to drop from sight not long before her body was found. While police couldn't prove who killed her, they had a good guess. They believed that a Mississippi man named Henderson James Williams was responsible. In 1994 he had been convicted of killing his mother, whose body was found in water off Hall Road in Grand Bay. The details of both crimes were very similar. Although police have yet to prove Henderson Williams is responsible for Ada's death, they were happy to give her her name back. It's Ada Fritz, and this is her story. 

Christina Castiglione Part 2 of 2

This is part 2 of the Christina Castiglione case; if you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part first. 

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Episode 96 Christina Castiglione Part 1 of 2

Christina Castiglione was last seen walking along Five Mile Road in Redford Township, MI.  The date was March 19th, 1983, and it was about 8:30 p.m. Her boyfriend waited for her at a store up ahead, but she never showed.  In the distance of about a half mile, she vanished.  Her half nude, strangled body was found a week later, miles away in a state-owned recreation area.  Her murder immediately called to mind another murder, almost exactly one year earlier.  Kim Louiselle was last seen looking for a ride home in Livonia, MI, on March 20th, 1982. She, too, vanished seemingly into thin air. Her body was found a month later, nude and strangled in a different state-owned recreation area. The two cases were always considered to be connected, but two murders proved no easier to solve than one, and decades passed. Not until forensic genealogy solved Christina’s case were answers also found in Kim’s case.  The same man had killed both women, and when police dug into his past, they discovered some extremely disturbing information about who Charles Shaw was.

This episode is sponsored by Factor, chef-prepared, ready-to-eat meals delivered to your door. Visit this link and use promo code DNA50 to save 50% on your Factor order. 

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Episode 95 Doe ID: Eileen Truppner

In 1998, an unidentified victim of a brutal rape and murder who was left for dead was found by chance by a boater in a grassy area in southwest Broward County off of U.S. 27 in the state of Florida. The dead woman carried no identification, and did not match any missing women in the area. Attempts to ID her initially failed, although police suspected that she may be the victim of a serial predator in that area who had fled the United States. Years later, when DNA evidence was re-examined in  an effort to ID the victim through genealogy, police caught a break. The genealogy determined that the victim was Eileen Truppner;  a down on her luck woman who had bounced around the area prior to her death. But the re-examination of DNA that led to Eileen's identity, also led to that of her killer; Lucious Boyd, who turned out to be a different predator than the one police initially suspected. Boyd is on death row for his other crimes, and a case is currently being built against him in Eileen's case.

This Florida Jane Doe finally has her name back, it's Eileen Truppner, and this is her story. 

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Episode 94 Rachael Johnson Part 2 of 2 

This is part 2 of the Rachael Johnson case. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, go back and listen to that part first. 

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Episode 94 Rachael Johnson Part 1 of 2

In 1991, a woman was found lying in the street near Akron, Ohio, half naked and set ablaze.  She was quickly identified as Rachael Johnson, a young single mother who had last been seen walking in the parking lot of a local convenience store.  A thorough investigation by Akron police looked at everyone Rachael knew even remotely – investigators were certain that she knew her killer.  They were right, but it was not until decades later that forensic genealogy pointed them to someone they had never considered – someone who Rachael’s family knew all too well.

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Episode 93 DOE: ID Robert Mullins

On November 1st, 1991, hunters in Circleville, Ohio discovered unidentified human remains in a shallow grave near a private farm. Based on the size of the remains, the authorities thought that they belonged to a young woman. They also found evidence that the Doe's head had been moved with some kind of toothed saw, possibly indicating a homicide. After searching for missing women who might be a match for the Doe, police came up empty, and the case went cold. Over the years, various teams and experts worked with the remains, and the DNA gathered from them, and eventually discovered that the Jane Doe they had was actually a John Doe; the victim was a male. Eventually, DNA & genealogy led the authorities to ID the remains as belonging to Robert A. Mullins who was reported missing by his family. He had disappeared in Ohio in late 1988, or early 1989 when he was 21. Now the investigators knew who their victim was, but the search to find out the circumstances of his death, and who was involved, goes on. 

The case remains an open homicide investigation with the Pickaway County Sheriff’s Office. Anyone with information about the case is urged to contact Lt. Jonathan Strawser at (740) 474-2176.

This Doe finally has his name back; it's Robert Mullins, and this is his story. 

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In 2024 , for the second year in a row, DNA: ID has been invited to be on podcast row at the Crimecon true crime convention. Stop by and say hi to host Jessica Bettencourt, pick up some goodies, and enter for a chance to win some DNA ID swag. 

Crimecon 2024 is happening at the Gaylord Opryland in Nashville, TN May 31st to June 2nd, 2024. DNA: ID listeners can save 10% on their  standard Crimecon badges at checkout when they use code: DNAID (all one word). Don't delay because badges and hotel accommodations are going quickly. Hope to see you there! 

Episode 92 Pam Cahanes and Kathy Hicks Part 3 of 3

This is part 3 of 3 in the case of Pam Cahanes and Kathy Hicks. If you have not listened to parts 1 & 2 yet, stop now and go back and listen to those parts first. 

This episode is sponsored by Hello Fresh home delivery meal kits. Go to HelloFresh.com/dnafree  and use code dnafree for FREE breakfast for life! One breakfast item per box while subscription is active. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage Visit this link to buy DNA ID Merch

Episode 92 Pam Cahanes and Kathy Hicks Part 2 of 3

This is part 2 of 3 in the case of Pam Cahanes and Kathy Hicks. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part first. 

This episode is sponsored by Hello Fresh home delivery meal kits. Go to HelloFresh.com/dnafree  and use code dnafree for FREE breakfast for life! One breakfast item per box while subscription is active. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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Episode 92 Pam Cahanes and Kathy Hicks Part 1 of 3

Season 4 of DNA: ID kicks off with a massive 3 part episode; In 1982, young Naval recruit Pam Cahanes had finally finished boot camp and graduated with her apprentice airman class. A weekend Liberty Pass allowed Pam to leave the Naval Training Center Orlando base for the first time in months. But Pam didn’t live to enjoy her newfound freedom. She was found strangled in her underwear, in the yard of a vacant house, shopping bags of personal items and her clothing strewn around her.  Despite an extensive investigation, DNA evidence, and a prime suspect, her case went cold.  This case was one of the first in Florida to use Forensic Genealogy to identify a suspect, someone never named in the case file.  And when that person’s DNA was entered into CODIS, the investigators learned that he WAS named in the case file – in a murder case in Hawaii two years before Pam’s.

This episode is sponsored by Hello Fresh home delivery meal kits. Go to HelloFresh.com/dnafree  and use code dnafree for FREE breakfast for life! One breakfast item per box while subscription is active. 

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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When a charismatic young doctor announces revolutionary treatments for cancer and HIV, patients from around the world turn to him for their last chance. As medical experts praise Serhat Gumrukcu’s genius, the company he co-founded rockets in value to over half a billion dollars. But when a team of researchers makes a startling discovery, they begin to   suspect the brilliant doctor is hiding a secret. From Wondery, the new season of Dr. Death: Bad Magic is a story of miraculous cures, magic and murder. Hosted by Laura Beil. Listen to Dr. Death - Bad Magic: http://wondery.fm/MAGIC_ID

In our final episode of 2023, we review the full length cases we covered this season on DNA:ID as well as the Doe mini episodes. We also touch on current events, trials, and news, that may affect past cases, and change the future of investigative genealogy. 

DNA: ID will return for an all new season on January 29, 2024. Happy holidays to all of our listeners.

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Episode 90 DOE: ID 'Jonesport John Doe' Philip Kahn

On July, 24th, 2000, an unidentified man's body was found floating 27 miles off the coast of Jonesport, Maine.  Due to the lack of ID, and condition of his remains, not much could be gathered to help investigators determine who this John Doe was, or how he died, although they were able to determine that he did have some specific health issues. The man known as 'Jonesport John Doe' was cremated and buried in an area cemetery. A sample of his DNA was collected with hopes that he would one day be identified, although early attempts proved fruitless.

Eventually, genealogy made it possible to determine that Jonesport John Doe was actually a man named Philip Kahn who had been reported missing by his family in Las Vegas shortly before his body was found. Why Kahn left his family behind and how and why he wound up in Maine remains a mystery. Confounding the mystery is the fact that Philip Kahn may actually have been someone else altogether; creating a mystery within a mystery.

'Jonesport John Doe' finally has his name back; it's Philip Kahn, and this is his story.

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Edna Laughman Part 2 of 2

This is the conclusion of the Edna Laughman episode. If you have not yet listened to part 1, stop now and go back and listen to that part first. 

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Episode 89 Edna Laughman Part 1 of 2

In 1987, someone broke into Edna Laughman’s home and suffocated and raped the 85 year old widow.  She was found by her relative and best friend, Madeline Laughman.  Within 2 weeks, Madeline’s son was arrested for Edna’s slaying.  Barry Laughman “confessed” to the crime, and was tried, convicted, and spent 15 years in prison for a crime he did not commit.  Barry was finally exonerated by updated DNA testing in 2003.  But the investigation into who killed his elderly relative was back to Square 1. The case languished until forensic genealogy pointed the investigators to Edna’s killer – someone who had been right under their noses the whole time.

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Episode 88 DOE: ID 'Queens Backyard John Doe' George Seitz

In 2019, a woman called into Queens PD with a tip. She recalled that as a child in the late 1970's, she believed that her and her mom had witnessed her mom's then-boyfriend, Martin Motta, clean up, and cover up a murder he had committed in his barber shop, before dismembering his victim's remains to dispose of them. Although the witness couldn't provide exact details and dates, police took her seriously. She told police that some of the remains were likely buried in on the property she lived in as a child. Police wasted no time searching the area, and were able to recover human remains exactly where the tipster told them they would find them. And just as she had indicated, there was evidence that the victim; a man, had been dismembered. 

Although police had a murder victim on their hands, they didn't know who he was, so they turned to genealogy to identify the victim. It turned out that he was a WW1 veteran named George Clarence Seitz. The 81 year old had been reported missing after going out for a haircut in 1976 and he never returned. Unfortunately, George Seitz was able to survive a war, but he didn't survive a trip to Martin Motta's barber shop. He was killed for the large amount of cash he carried with him. Martin Motta was tried and convicted for Seitz's murder and sent to prison. 

'Queens Backyard John Doe' now has his name back; it's George Seitz, and this is his story. 

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Episode 87 Christine Franke Part 2 of 2

This is the conclusion of the Christine Franke case. If you have not listened to Part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part first. 

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Episode 87 Christine Franke Part 1 of 2

In 2001, Orlando bartender and college student Christine Franke was attacked, shot, sexually assaulted and robbed in her own apartment.  The evidence showed that she had just walked in the door from work when her assailant struck. DNA was collected from Christine’s person. Her romantic partner told police of a stalker, who was tracked down after an extensive investigation. The DNA ruled him out.  After 17 years, police finally turned to the burgeoning new technique, forensic genealogy, which led them to focus on a very large family in Georgia.  In this early forensic genealogy case, reference samples obtained from family members via a ruse led to the killer, and obtained justice for Christine, but left the killer’s family feeling manipulated. 

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Episode 86 Doe: ID 'Cheatham Jane Doe' Linda Karnes

In October, 1981, skeletal remains were found by hunters at an old landfill in Cheatham County, Tennessee  on Highway 249 in Ashland City.  Forensic anthropologists at the University of Tennessee determined the remains belonged to a young, white female, estimated to be between 14 and 17 years old. She carried no ID, and her arms were missing, presumably taken by scavaging animals, so fingerprinting was not an option. But part of her legs were also missing, and showed signs of being removed with a saw. It was clear to authorities that this young girl, who was dubbed 'Cheatham Jane Doe',  had been a murder victim and they set out to determine who she was and who was responsible for her death. 

Decades later, DNA & genealogy would combine to reveal her identity as Linda Sue Karnes, who had spent time as a teenager in the Montgomery County Girls Home in Clarksville not long before her remains were found. Although authorities now know who she is, it's not clear what led to Linda's murder, or who is responsible. Police are still trying to fill in the blanks and are seeking the public's help. Anyone with pertinent details is encouraged to contact the TBI at 1-800-TBI-FIND or via email at [email protected]

After more four decades, 'Cheatham County Jane Doe' has her name back, it's Linda Sue Karnes, and this is her story.

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Episode 85 Ellen Mathys and David Schuldes Part 2 of 2

This is part 2 of the Mathys/Schuldes case, if you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to part 1 first. 

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Episode 85 Ellen Mathys and David Schuldes Part 1 of 2

A stunning double murder shocked quiet, rural Marinette, Wisconsin in 1976.  A loving engaged couple went camping in one of the verdant parks in the northern part of the state – and were found dead.  David had been shot in the throat; Ellen had been raped and shot to death.  The senseless, seemingly random crime double homicide rocked Marinette County, and set determined investigators on a 40 year journey to catch a killer.  Despite a good sketch of the suspect, he remained unidentified until forensic genealogy led investigators right to his door – 20 miles from the park where he had slain David and Ellen. Prosecutors put together a case against grandfather Raymand Vannieuwenhoven that was largely based on the DNA – would it be enough for the jury?

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In June, 1979, the body of an unidentified woman was found near Highway 290 and FM 696 in Elgin, Bastrop County, Texas. The condition of her remains made it tough to determine a cause of death, let alone figure out who she was. Police theorized that she was the victim of a hit and run due to a broken pelvis. She was laid to rest in Elgin cemetery. Years later, in an effort ID the unknown Jane Doe, her body was exhumed multiple times for DNA testing. Finally, she was identified via forensic genetic genealogy, as Kathy Ann Smith. To date,not much has been shared publicly about Kathy's background besides the fact she was adopted. While police are still investigating her death and can't confirm whether she was murdered, infamous serial killer Henry Lee Lucas confessed to Kathy's murder before recanting. Police have not ruled Lucas out in Kathy's death. 

If you have any information about Kathy's case, please call the Bastrop County Sheriff’s Office at 512-549-5100

After more than three decades, this Texas Jane Doe has her name back, it's Kathy Ann Smith, and this is her story. 

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Episode 83 Cheryl Thompson

Cheryl Thompson was missing for 15 days in 1978 before her body turned up dumped on a riverbank in Loveland, Ohio. Investigators weren’t certain whether she’d been held captive, alive – and they also weren’t sure what to make of the story her boyfriend told. It involved car chases, blown tires, shaggy haired strange men – all on the last night Cheryl was seen.

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Episode 82 DOE: ID 'Frog Boy' Winston 'Wint' Maxey III

In July, 1971, some teen boys in Coos Bay, Oregon discovered a decomposed body along Snedden Creek. The body was that of a young male in his teens, but due to the condition of the body, the medical examiner could not determine exactly when the young man had died, or a cause of death, but he deemed it suspicious. Since there was no ID with the body, investigators didn't know who the young man they affectionately called 'Frog Boy' was, and their efforts to find someone missing from the area that matched his description came up empty. 

For decades, the identity of Frog Boy remained a mystery until advancements in DNA & genealogy finally provided a name for him; Winston 'Wint' Maxey III, who had left his Idaho home as a teenager, and had never been reported missing. It turned out that his daughter, who was born weeks after Wint went missing and put up for adoption, had been looking for him.

 Questions remain to this day. How exactly did Wint die, and was he the victim of foul play?

'Frog Boy' now has his name back; it's Winston 'Wint' Maxey III, and this is his story.

If you have information about Wint, please contact Captain Patterson at (541)-396-7820 or call the Coos County Sheriff’s Office at (541) 396-7800.

Visit the Facebook page set up by Wint's Daughter Lori to learn more about the case, or to help Lori find more information on her father. 

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Episode 81 Lisa Holstead Part 2 of 2

This is the second part of the Lisa Holstead case. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and listen to that part first. 

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Episode 81 Lisa Holstead Part 1 of 2

Lisa Holstead vanished sometime between 2:30 and 3:30 a.m. on the night of August 12th-13th, 1986.  Her boyfriend told the police Lisa had jumped out of his car after an argument, and he never saw her again. Police were skeptical of this story, even after two witnesses said they saw Lisa getting out of the vehicle at a stop light.  Lisa was found the next day in a nearby marsh.  She’d been strangled by her own braided hair.  Her boyfriend became the target of the family’s suspicions and the police investigation for years to come.  Not until forensic genealogy pointed modern investigators in another direction altogether was Lisa’s case finally cracked, and her real killer brought to justice.

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Episode 80 DOE: ID 'Nogales John Doe' Donald Sigurd Hadland Jr. In September, 2002, a man using the name 'Edward C', checked into the low budget Time motel in Nogales, Arizona. He claimed to the hotel manager that he was there to get surgery in Mexico. Just days after checking in, the mysterious Edward C was found dead in his hotel room. An autopsy determined that the guest had died of an apparent accidental overdose. When the authorities tried to notify the man's next of kin, they discovered that he was using a false identity; one that had been stolen from a real Edward C, and he was alive and well in Florida. That began a years-long search for the man's identity. Eventually, in 2023,  a determined group of college students taking a genealogy course provided the answer. The man who had been dubbed 'Nogales John Doe' was actually Donald Sigurd Hadland Jr. His family had lost track of him years before. Although the authorities finally knew who he was, questions remain, including just why it was that he chose to steal the identities of others.  "Nogales John Doe' now has his name back; it's Donald Sigurd Hadland Jr, and this is his story.  

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

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Episode 79 Jeanne Childs Part  2 of 2 

This is part 2 of the case of Jeanne Childs. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to part 1 first. 

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Episode 79 Jeanne Childs Part 1 of 2 

The 1993 stabbing murder of 35 year old Jeanne Childs was just one of the many homicides Minneapolis investigators had to deal with during the “Murderapolis” era.  But crime scene technicians did a thorough job, and carefully preserved many crucial pieces of evidence from the bloody scene in the apartment Jeanne shared with her boyfriend and alleged pimp, Arthur.  Several potential suspects emerged, including a man who had killed another woman in a similar fashion, and a man whose blood was found near Jeanne’s apartment.  But one clue – a set of bloody male footprints, would prove to be a vital supplement to the male DNA found at the scene. Forensic genealogy led investigators to a man whose name was not on police radar – but was in Jeanne’s client list.  His name is Jerry Westrom, and his footprints placed him in Jeanne’s apartment next to her bloody corpse.

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AbJack Entertainment, the true crime network that brings you DNA: ID and several other true crime podcasts, would like to introduce you to AbJack Insider through Apple Podcasts.

What is AbJack Insider? It's a value-based subscription that gives listeners VIP access to not only DNA:ID, but to every other show on the AbJack network. You’ll get things like AD-FREE and early episodes, bonus content, and AD-FREE listening.

Every episode of every show on AbJack published in August, 2023 and after, will be AD-FREE with an AbJack Insider subscription. In addition, several shows on the network already have completely AD-FREE and bonus content published in the AbJack Insider APP, and more and more previously published episodes will be added to the AD-FREE lineup.

There are several DNA: ID episodes already available to listen to ad-free. You’ll get access to exclusive content not available without a subscription, and in some cases, episodes in advance of their publish date giving AbJack Insiders the first chance at hearing new material.

Your subscription will get you VIP access to every podcast on the network, and any new shows added to the network, for one low price of $4.99 per month, or $49.99 per year. You can also start off with a free trial subscription to see if it’s for you. Simply visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.

AbJack Entertainment is dedicated to bringing you the best in Indie true crime podcasts, and your support with an AbJack Insider subscription will support the network, and all of the hosts who are focused on continuing to bring you all of the great content you’re looking for.

On behalf of the AbJack network, its shows, and hosts, thank you for your support.

Episode 78 Carol Sue Klaber Part 2 of 2

This is part 2 of 2 of the Carol Sue Klaber case. If you have not listened to part 1 yet, stop now and go back and listen to that part before listening to this part.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage: DNAIDpodcast.com To Support DNA: ID on Patreon, visit this link: https://www.patreon.com/DNAID To buy DNA ID Merch, visit this link: https://www.customizedgirl.com/s/dnaidpodcast Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast 

Episode 78 Carol Sue Klaber Part 1 of 2

In June 1976, 16 year old Carol Sue Klaber was found in a ditch, half nude and bludgeoned to death.  She had last been seen by multiple witnesses getting into a distinctive sedan driven by a tall, slender, blond young man.  But no one knew who he was. Multiple leads and suspects failed to pan out.  Then two years later a horrific rape happened in Park Hills that almost exactly mirrored Carol’s case, down to the description of the suspect. Unfortunately, police didn’t know who this rapist was, either.  Both cases went unsolved for more than 40 years. When cold case investigators reopened the Carol Klaber case, they ended up solving both: one using forensic genealogy, and the other, using old fashioned methods.

Part 2 of this episode is available now. 

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Episode 77 DOE ID; 'Granby Girl' Patricia Ann Tucker 

In November, 1978, the unidentified remains of a woman were found in a logging area in Granby, Massachusetts. Police determined that the woman, who was estimated to be in her 20's, had been shot in the head and was a homicide victim. A belt was found wrapped around her neck, an indication that the killer had used it to drag the body to where it was found. Police were not able to link the unidentified woman to any local missing persons cases, and she was dubbed 'Granby Girl'. She was laid to rest in a grave marked 'unknown'.

Decades later, armed with advancements in DNA & forensic genealogy, investigators exhumed Granby Girl's body in an attempt to finally ID her. Using genealogy, it was determined that 'Granby Girl' was actually Patricia Ann Tucker who was last known to be living on the shore of Lake Pocotopaug in East Hampton, Connecticut with her husband, Gerald Coleman. Patricia was last seen when her and her husband Gerald dropped off her son Matthew at a friend's home in Chicopee, Massachusetts in August 1978. They told the friend that they would be back soon after looking for an apartment, but never returned. CPS was called in by the friend to pick up Matthew, but for some reason, a search for Patricia was never initiated. Gerald Coleman never reported his wife missing, and it came to light that he had a troubling criminal record. He died in prison for an unrelated crime, and he remains at the top of the police suspect list as they try and close Patricia's murder case.

Anyone with information about the case of Patricia Ann Tucker, or her husband Gerald Coleman, is asked to call Granby Police at 413-467-9222 or email [email protected] or visit the Granbypd.org website.

Eventually. DNA & genealogy gave 'Granby Girl' her name back. She was Patricia Ann Tucker and this is her story.

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Episode 76 Leslie Perlov and Janet Taylor Part 2 of 2.

This is the conclusion of the case of Leslie Perlov and Janet Taylor. If you have not already listened to part 1, stop now and go back and listen to it before listening to this second part. 

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage: DNAIDpodcast.com To Support DNA: ID on Patreon, visit this link: https://www.patreon.com/DNAID To buy DNA ID Merch, visit this link: https://www.customizedgirl.com/s/dnaidpodcast Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast

Episode 76 Leslie Perlov and Janet Taylor Part 1 of 2 

In 1973, Leslie Perlov, Stanford graduate and Stanford Law Library clerk, was found slain in the hills overlooking the Stanford campus. In 1974, it happened again. Janet Taylor was found in a roadside ditch, after hitchhiking on the Stanford campus.  The similarities between the two cases were startling, down to the identical ages of the victims.  Investigators were so desperate for suspects, they interviewed the likes of Ed Kemper and Ted Bundy.  But those famed serial killers weren’t involved in the Stanford murders – another serial killer was, one who was as of yet unknown – one who also had ties to Stanford.  When forensic genealogy revealed his name, people who knew him were shocked.  But women who had survived his predatory behavior were not - they knew what John Arthur Getreu was capable of.

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage: DNAIDpodcast.com To Support DNA: ID on Patreon, visit this link: https://www.patreon.com/DNAID To buy DNA ID Merch, visit this link: https://www.customizedgirl.com/s/dnaidpodcast Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast

Episode 75 Doe ID; Claudette Jean Zebolsky Powers

On February 16, 1986, human remains were found in the northern San Diego, CA community of Warner Springs near a camp site on the Los Coyotes Indian reservation. The remains were found to belong to a woman who had no identification with her. Although decomposition, and scavenger activity had taken their toll and scattered her remains, police were able to estimate that she was a caukasian and between 20 and years old. An autopsy could not pinpoint a cause of death, but she was found to have been a victim of homicidal violence.

The woman was simply listed as a Jane Doe, and cremated. Investigators collected some of her hair including a root, and decades later, that would prove beneficial. Eventually, San Diego investigators employed genetic genealogy and learned that their Jane Doe was actually, Claudette Jean Zebolsky Powers. She was in her mid 20s at the time she died. Her family in Michigan had lost touch with her when she moved out West with her husband who was in the Army, and very little is known about Claudette's life leading up to her murder. 

Police are still digging to try and figure out who may be responsible for Claudette's death, and they are also considering whether or not the death of another unidentified set of remains, a man, found in the same general area during that time frame may be connected to Claudette's case. This San Diego Jane Doe has her name back, it's Claudette Jean Zebolsky Powers, and this is her story.

Deputies are offering a potential $1,000 reward for information leading to a felony arrest and have asked people to call the Sheriff’s Homicide Unit at (858) 285-6330. Tipsters can remain anonymous by calling Crime Stoppers at (888) 580-8477

For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage: DNAIDpodcast.com To Support DNA: ID on Patreon, visit this link: https://www.patreon.com/DNAID To buy DNA ID Merch, visit this link: https://www.customizedgirl.com/s/dnaidpodcast Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast

Episode 74 Susan Negersmith

In 1990, 20 year old college student Susan Negersmith went to beach town Wildwood, NJ with friends for Memorial Day weekend. Her body was found behind a local restaurant, half naked, shoeless, bloody, riddled with injuries, and with visible marks on her throat. Someone had taken pains to ensure she was obscured from view of passersby – yet her death was ruled an accident. It took her father 6 years to get her death certificate changed to reflect that her death was a homicide – but by that time, the damage was done. Even forensic genealogy, with its wondrous power to provide answers, may not be able to deliver justice for Susan Negersmith.

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Episode 67 Heather Porter Heather Porter had a fight with her mother and walked out of her Baltimore County, Maryland house on a Tuesday night in September 1981. She hung out with some friends, but around 11:10 p.m., started the .4 mile walk home. It was a school night, and Heather was just 13. She never made it. Somewhere in that distance of less than a half mile, Heather was abducted. Her body was found the next morning, miles away in Towson, raped and strangled. Police investigated the case thoroughly, but were stumped, and decades passed. Finally, forensic genealogy pointed to a man who lived in the area at the time – and had an extensive history of rape. John Petrecca had no known connections to Heather – but he was the one who raped her and snuffed out her short life. For all things DNA: ID, visit the show's homepage: DNAIDpodcast.com To Support DNA: ID on Patreon, visit this link: https://www.patreon.com/DNAID To buy DNA ID Merch, visit this link: https://www.customizedgirl.com/s/dnaidpodcast Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast/ This show is part of the Spreaker Prime Network, if you are interested in advertising on this podcast, contact us at https://www.spreaker.com/show/4720335/advertisement

Episode 44 LaQuetta Gunther, Julie Green, and Iwana Patton Part 2 of 2 In part 2, the killer of LaQuetta Gunther, Julie Green, and Iwana Patton in Florida is finally brought to justice and held accountable for his deeds. This episode is sponsored by GEDMatch, whether you want to find out more about your family's history, help catch the bad guys we discuss on DNA: ID, or help give names to unidentified 'Does', Gedmatch has you covered. Visit Gedmatch.com/DNAID To Support DNA: ID on Patreon, visit this link: https://www.patreon.com/DNAID To buy DNA ID Merch, visit this link: https://www.customizedgirl.com/s/dnaidpodcast Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast/ Podcast home page- https://www.spreaker.com/show/dna-id This show is part of the Spreaker Prime Network, if you are interested in advertising on this podcast, contact us at https://www.spreaker.com/show/4720335/advertisement

DNA: ID Episode 1 Jody Loomis In 1972, Jody Loomis was raped, shot in the head and left for dead in rural Snohomish County, Washington. Police were stymied in their hunt for her killer – Jody had no enemies, and all persons of interest were ruled out. Her case went cold. But a fortuitous discovery permitted investigators to use forensic genealogy to point to a family of six brothers, one of whom was her killer. Jody’s case was solved after 48 years of anguish for her family.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription. Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast/ Podcast home page- https://www.spreaker.com/show/dna-id

Welcome to DNA: ID This short welcome to the podcast discusses the types of cases we’ll be covering, and gives a brief refresher about the terminology listeners will be hearing relating to forensic genealogy.

To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription. Follow DNA: ID on Social Media on Twitter at- https://twitter.com/DNAIDPodcast on Facebook at- https://www.facebook.com/DNA-ID-True-Crime-Podcast-103667495017418 on Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/dnaidpodcast/ Podcast home page- https://www.spreaker.com/show/dna-id

DNA: ID Introduction We all hear stories almost daily now about cold cases being solved by investigative genetic genealogy. This new crime-solving tool answers the “who” question about these often decades-old crimes.... but what about the why? This podcast will look at crimes solved by genetic genealogy, and examine the connection - if any - between the victim and the killer, and why the crime occurred. Each case is unique, and has its own story behind the headline. In this preview of DNA: ID, Host Jess Bettencourt sits down with Investigator Paul Holes, who helped catch the infamous Golden State Killer, Joseph DeAngelo aided by genetic genealogy. Join us for DNA: ID. New episodes will come out every other week on Mondays beginning in January, 2021 Hosted and produced by Jess Bettencourt, Co-Produced by Mike Morford. DNA: ID is brought to you through a collaboration with AbJack Entertainment To listen to every episode of DNA: ID ad-free and get other benefits, simply  visit our channel page on Apple Podcasts to get started with an AbJack Insider subscription. Of course, you can also support DNA: ID with a Patreon subscription.