Being the Change We Want to See in the World: A Conversation with Christiana Figueres (Episode #21)

Welcome to episode 21 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.

In this episode, the presenters, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and lay Buddhist practitioner and journalist Jo Confino, are joined by special guest Christiana Figueres – one of the architects of the Paris Climate Agreement in 2015, student of Thich Nhat Hanh, and valued member of the Plum Village Sangha.

Ms. Figueres is an internationally recognized leader on global climate change. She was Executive Secretary of the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) from 2010 to 2016. Today she is the co-founder of Global Optimism, co-host of the podcast Outrage & Optimism and co-author of the The Future We Choose: Surviving the Climate Crisis book. She is a member of the B Team, non executive Board member of Acciona, and non executive Board member of Impossible Foods. Read more about her many achievements here.

In light of Thich Nhat Hanh’s passing earlier this year, the discussion includes collective leadership; guidance; spiritual awakening and nourishing our spiritual dimension; dependent co-arising; saving lives through teachings; and being a community without Thay, and what it means to continue and represent his legacy.

The participants also reflect on the impact on their lives of Thay’s passing, and ways to continue their teacher in a world that is in crisis and in great need for a spiritual dimension. And what next for the Sangha?

Christiana Figueres shares deeply about what brought her to Plum Village, both now and years ago, during her first encounter with Applied Buddhism; her journey to spiritual practice, to overcome a personal crisis; the historical context of making contact with Thich Nhat Hanh; and the transformative power of Buddhist teachings – such as the art of deep listening – on the negotiation process during the Paris Climate Change Conference.

Additionally, she addresses the Global North-South divide; victimhood; and strengthening the arc between the inner and outer worlds.

Jo shares what it means to be a “serious” practitioner; being spacious; “coming home”; and befriending our past.

Brother Phap Huu talks about Christiana’s importance to the Plum Village community, and the significance of her presence during the week of ceremonies after Thay’s passing; the four-fold sangha; channelling Thay as a collective community; interbeing in action; practising the art of community; and transmission.

The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu to bring us back to the present moment.

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Co-produced by the Plum Village App:
https://plumvillage.app/

And Global Optimism:
https://globaloptimism.com/ 

With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:
https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ 

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List of resources

‘Christiana Figueres Cites Thich Nhat Hanh’s Influence in Paris Climate Talks’
https://www.lionsroar.com/christiana-figueres-cites-thich-nhat-hanhs-influence-in-paris-climate-talks/ 

Waldbröl
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waldbr%C3%B6l

The Paris Agreement
https://unfccc.int/process-and-meetings/the-paris-agreement/the-paris-agreement 

Global North and Global South
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_North_and_Global_South 

Dharma Talks: ‘The Noble Eightfold Path’
https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-noble-eightfold-path/ 

Christian Science 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Science

European Institute of Applied Buddhism (EIAB)
https://www.eiab.eu/index.php?index=90

The Way Out Is In: ‘The Three Doors of Liberation’
https://plumvillage.org/podcast/the-three-doors-of-liberation-episode-18/ 

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Quotes

“The community is Thay’s masterpiece.”

“Thay is always teaching us and giving us this opportunity to still come together and see the beauty of connection.”

“We tend to think that, if we are on a path of spiritual development, it only has to do with me, but doesn’t have anything to do with the outside world. And it does. They are completely interwoven with each other.”

“With our thoughts, we create the world.”

“I would never want to send my children to a place where there is no suffering, because, in that place, my children will never be able to grow.”

“You know what? The sangha is not perfect, and there is beauty to it because we can continue to learn from each other, we can grow with each other. We have suffering. We have difficulties. We look at it. We learn from it. We evolve from it.”

“We carry our wounds with us. They are part of who we are. They are what make us a whole person.” 

“When I feel at home, when I feel my own presence, when I’m aware of my own wounds, then I can have a very beautiful relationship with other people.”

“I can be friends with my past. I can be friends with my suffering. I can make peace with it. I can honor it. I can see the sacredness in everything.” 

“If we want to see history, just look at Thay. He didn’t allow himself to be exiled to drown in despair and suffering; he was patient. He embraced. He cultivated. He contemplated. And he grew into that. So, in a way, this step-up moment is really channeling the insight that Thay has offered us and making it a part of our journey.”

“We don’t need to put Thay on a pedestal. Of course, we love and we respect Thay and we honor him, but what he would want from us is his insight to continue in us. And I think that’s really important.” 

“Transformation starts with the being and then the doing comes later, not the other way around.”

“The spiritual dimension is that bridge where we can connect to seeing us as Mother Earth, seeing us as the suffering, seeing us as the person cutting the trees, seeing us as the oil being spilled into the ocean. We are the fish that is suffering. We are the birds that are drowning in these oils. We are the animals that are being burnt and have no home.”

“We’re really there; you look at someone, you listen to them, and you’re giving them your trust, you’re giving them your presence, you’re giving them your energy, and that’s very recharging.”