01x01: Dallas Seavey | Building a team

JEANETTE: Hello and welcome to the first episode of our brand new podcast! We`re starting with one of the best mushers in the world. He won the Iditarod 4 times and broke the record 2 times. When he's not training or racing with his dogs, he is sharing his philosophy on how to build a team with everything from athletes to business leaders, and today he will share it with you – Dallas Seavey, all the way from Alaska – welcome to Norway!

DALLAS: I'm happy to be here in Norway once again. I've raced the Finnmark now twice and over the last two years I think I have been in Norway about five months. Mostly of course for the races but also coming over in the fall and preparing things or like now – coming over for a visit!

JEANETTE: Dogs have been a big part of your life, as far as I know since you were a kid?

DALLAS: My family has been mushing for 55 years now. It started with grandfather moving to Alaska because he was interested in sleddogs and the Alaskan way of life. It was supposed to be a couple of years, but he got hooked, and sleddogs have been a big part of my family's life ever since. I was born into a kennel of mini dogs, so all of my memories are around sleddogs, my earliest memories with sleddogs. That has been my life, yes.

JEANETTE: But you started doing a totally different sport when you were younger, you did wrestling?

DALLAS: Yeah, I wrestled for about seven years where that was my main focus. That is also something both my dad and grandpa had done. That was my experience as human athlete which I think has really been helpful in many ways to be more of what I consider is a coach – teaching athletes, which in this case is dogs. In a 1000 mile race the human has to be a part of that team and be an athlete as well, but our main value is supporting the dogs so that they can perform at their best. It is about developing a team that will do anything for you. I would not say make them do something for you, but make them a part of the team, and whatever that team does, we do it wholeheartedly and together. That is very important.

A sleddog is very much a pack animal. They rely on the security and the strength of a pack and they need to feel secure in that pack and they need to feel that if we’re gonna run out into a blizzard or cross a big river, og through deep snow, they’re never doing it alone. Even if they are the leader they know the rest of the team is right behind them and they’re gonna help them through this. At the core of how do you get the dog team or any dog to do what you want or to do it whole heartedly with you. It comes down to trust. It comes down to them knowing that you are never gonna ask the dog or dog team to do something that they can not do well. And I don’t mean just accomplish the task, but do it well and have fun doing it. Thats based on trust and a lifetime of teaching them that this is going to be fun, we are going to do it together and Im nevver going to ask you to do something you cant do.

JEANETTE: What do you do to build that confidence and when do you start?

DALLAS: It absolutely starts as a puppy. Every interaction you have with that dog form day one you're teaching them something, whether it is continuously or whether you are aware of that you are teaching them something, they are learning from every interaction with you, so it is important that every interaction is the right kind of interaction.

As a person you can’t fake that. You have to become the person you want to be. You can’t pretend to be in a certain way or pretend that you are honest or trustworthy. You just can’t do that every single day. And dogs will see through any act so that really needs to be your personality or your character.

But in the beginning we’re training Superman. That’s what I tell every handler we have working there. We’re training Superman with that meaning that we are training this dog to be invincible. To be able to do anything. The secret is to show them that they can do anything and never show them anything they can’t do.

In the beginning the human is the new thing in their environment. When they are little they are used to their mother, their little dog house and their siblings and as a person when we come into the pen, we’re the new thing that’s being introduced.

By being surrounded by the things they are familiar with it helps bridge the gap with something new. When they get to be a little bit older, when they are at five weeks, by now they are used to the human being in the pen, bringing the puppies with them in the house and petting them and whatever. Now its time to goon little walks and I really love this transition because now when we take the puppy, usually just one maybe two, out into the field or wherever we want to go or hike somewhere – obviously with a five week old puppy we are not going very far, but it is interesting to see where now the environment is what’s new and the human is the one familiar thing. This is the major transition where we are no longer the new thing in their life, and for the rest of their life were gonna be the thing that helps bridge the gap between the familiar and the unfamiliar. We're gonna help interpret the world for these dogs, we're gonna help them understand every new thing they see whether that is a city when you are getting ready for the Iditarod or a blizzard or a storm in the mountain on the Iditarod trail or some of my lead dogs go and do presentations and they will be on a stage in front of 3.000 people. Whatever that environment change is, I am always the bridge.

JEANETTE: If something wrong happens and your dog has a bad experience – how do you handle it?

DALLAS: Calmly. It is not what the challenge is, it’s how the team handles the challenge. Things happen in life. You’re gonna have good days, bad days – things happen when you are mushing with a team. You’re gonna get caught in a blizzard, and how do you handle it? I think the dogs are willing to, or any team, is willing to forgive if things are done honestly and with the teams best interest in mind.

So take for example you get into a big blizzard and maybe it is more than you can mush through, but if you look at it from a dog’s point of view, they never knew that we were supposed to go through the blizzard. They never knew that we were supposed to end up at another checkpoint, that is a human mentality and understanding. What they do know is that we found a somewhat sheltered place and waited out the storm. Yes it is windy and yes it is cold but we as a group made this decision and the musher was always in control in contrast to if the musher keeps pushing, because in our mind we have to make it to the next checkpoint and if ever the dog say “I can’t do what they’re asking me to do” then you just broken trust and you’re gonna end up camping in the middle of the blizzard but it will be because the dogs couldn’t make it. That`s an entirely different setting.

If you are in a bad situation or if something goes not how you planned – take control of it. Take a controlled landing rather than a crash landing. Try to find a way to regain control of the situation and find out: What is the best thing I can do for this dog team right now? In 10 seconds, 10 days or over the next 10 years?

JEANETTE: Is that a common mistake, that their focus is a bit wrong?

DALLAS: Most common mistake and an honest mistake is that we see things from a human perspective. Most people have spent their entire life being a human.

When we see a problem we naturally see that problem from a human perspective but our team is not a team of humans, our team is a team of dogs. They will look at the same problem very differently. While we think we are solving the problem or think it shouldn’t be a problem because we can cognitively understand that is something the team doesn’t necessarily see.

Always remember that you have to look at the problem from your dog’s point of view, not your point of view. Think about if you’re travelling with a dog anywhere – we are gonna think logistically, like are we going to catch the next flight or do I have enough fuel to make it , where are we going to spend the night? Those are not problems to your dog! All they know is they have been in the crate and they really have to pee!

Look at what is the problem for the dog? Also, the dog may not see any problem but yet the human is all stressed out, and now they are starting to think are the human or my leader of this pack irrational? Cause here they are totally stressed over something that the dog sees no problem.

Other times we can cognitively understand that the next checkpoint is only three miles away and it has been a long day but it is not a big deal – we’re almost there. But we only know that because we can see the GPS and we know the plan. The dog doesn`t know the plan or see the GPS so you always have to be aware of maybe they are starting to be nervous and you are not supporting them or acknowledging their concern. See the problem as your dog sees it.

JEANETTE: How do you use your knowledge to motivate them?

DALLAS: First of all I don’t generally try to motivate them to do more than they should because I don’t want to push a team. That is not really the goal. The goal is to support the team and if the team is well hydrated, well rested and has good body fat they are going to do well. And this comes back to a lifetime of training and teaching these dogs that every time we take off for a run they’re gonna be able to make it to the next stop pulling hard, having a good time – they are not going to get tired on this run and that`s something you have to do with them every single day.

I hate doing long runs. I almost never do long runs and races because you teach the team that they has to preserve themselves. You’re not going to protect them, they have to back off, they have to decide not to pull so hard and that’s not something I ever want my team to learn. My guys spend their entire life learning that they can lean into the harness, work hard and I will be responsible enough to stop before they get tired. It is not a trick to get them to work hard, it is just teaching them that they can always work hard and they’re never going to get too tired doing that.

JEANETTE: How do you start training a young dog?

DALLAS: Slowly. I have talked to a lot of different mushers and people in different dog sports and a lot of people are very opinionated on when you start putting a harness on your dog. I think that is highly individual and I don’t think there is any hurry in my specific sport.

I start out doing a lot of loose running, puppy walks to the forest. You are building confidence, a good agility base on that dog by bouncing through the forest – this is great development. I usually end up putting a harness on a dog around a year old. That’s a highly individual thing. Some puppies you can put them in a team and hook up six puppies that have never had a harness on before and they do great. Other groups I will spend a lot of time doing canicross with them, getting them comfortable to their harness.

Some dogs I will put a harness on them and let them run loose next to the team and let them gradually decide when they are comfortable enough to buddy up next to their brother or sister and join the team. That’s a great way of overcoming the fear og being tied together and usually a loud cart or four wheeler behind them, sometimes a sled that is making strange noises. They can get comfortable with those noises from a little bit of distance.

Then the first year that they are in harness, between one and two years old, it`s really about repetition. I don`t care about building any cardiovascular base, it`s just getting out there, doing exercise five days a week. Up to maybe 20 mile runs, which for a long distance sleddog is nothing. That’s just a fun jog.

The next year, between two and three, they`ll actually start doing some more serious training but now their bodies are primarily fully developed.

Emotionally, mentally they are not fully developed, they’re still very immature. They are not going to tryout or race in my team until they are three years old, and even as three-year-old’s they are rookie, I`m not relying on them. A lot of times we skip that third year and don’t count on them until they are four.

JEANETTE: How do you put together a team and decide how to mix young dogs with experienced dogs?

DALLAS: One of the fun arts of this thing is putting together a team. Your first job is to develop each individual dog. Once you’ve done that you can start to kind of bring them together into a team.

I’ve never had so many dogs that’s been like trying to build that team and this fits better. It’s always been these are the dogs we have, these are the best athletes and they are going to have to work together and we have to solve those problems, work through those problems.

Sometimes that means sometimes you get dogs that simply does not get along. Obviously we can keep them separated but is there some anxiety because this dog is here so trying to develop these relationships and trying to make these dogs be comfortable with each other and around each other. I think you have to recognize if this is a young team or an old team or some of each, and what is our strength?

If it is mostly a young team on a long distance race our strength is probably going to be more speed, but we are going to have to keep the runs shorter and do more frequent rest. If it is just an old team that does not have that top end speed they probably do have a little more confidence and developed endurance and strength that way so we’re probably going to do longer slower runs, keep the speed down. When you recognize the team you do have, you then have to find how does this team be successful? How do I play to their strengths and avoid their weaknesses?

JEANETTE: Can you tell us a bit more about your dogs – how many do you have, how do they live? As far as I know you are building a new kennel, or did you already do it?

DALLAS: Yeah, I moved about two years ago and finally had a big piece of property where I could build the kennel I wanted to build for some time. I have spent many years trying to figure out what a perfect kennel look like? What we came up with is more of a zipline system of tethering dogs.

I’ve played with the idea of pens but honestly, with a large kennel I don’t like pens for two main reasons: One – it decreases the interaction with the dogs. You always have a gate between you and the dog and as it is now I can walk through the yard and pet one dog and the next do